HP STAB

[Sceptile_Master]

Okay here is the question. Most people know that hidden power is given the type normal on the status screen, although it can be any type but normal. But if you use it and someone uses counter, it is countered as if it was a normal attack. So then here it is. Does Hidden power only get STAB if the pokemon using it is a normal type, and is it always treated as a pysical attack (like normal attacks). I don't think the aformentioned two are true, but I am just wondering.

[andyizcool]

I'm sure Hidden Power does gain STAB from typing. For example if a Grass Pokemon used HP Grass they would gain STAB on it.

[Animelee]

If a Miltank used Hidden Power, she wouldn't get STAB, even though Hidden Power is listed as a Normal-type move. And Hidden Power can never be a Normal-type move.

If a Flygon used Hidden Power, and it was a Dragon or Ground-type, then he/she would get STAB. If it was an Ice-type, then he/she would not get STAB.

So even though Hidden Power is listed as a Normal-type, Normal-types cannot get STAB from it, because Hidden Power's actual type can be anything BUT Normal, even though it's listed as Normal. If you ask me, it should be listed as ??? like Curse.

[Silent Dragonfly]

Showing it as Normal is very misleading, even though they changed it from Psychic (GSC), if anything it should be ??? like Curse is.

STAB is applied if the user is the same type as their Hidden Power, for example if an Aerodactyl used HP Rock it WOULD gain STAB because it is a Rock Type, but a Snorlax using HP Fire would not because Snorlax is Normal, and not Fire.

EDIT: Animelee, HP Normal is the only Hidden Power type that doesn't exist

[andyizcool]

If a Miltank used Hidden Power, and it was a Ground-type Hidden Power, then she wouldn't get STAB. If she used Hidden Power, and it was a Normal-type, only then would she get STAB.

Normal-Pokémon with Normal HP will get you STAB, but not Normal-Pokémon with Fighting HP, for example.
I'll give you some advice and tell you Hidden Power can't be a Normal Type. ;)

[Sceptile_Master]

I'll give you some advice and tell you Hidden Power can't be a Normal Type.

Yeah that's what I stated in my original post. Looky.


although it can be any type but normal

[Animelee]

I'll give you some advice and tell you Hidden Power can't be a Normal Type. ;)

Woops, I wasn't thinking. :sorry:

[Orion]

But if you use it and someone uses counter, it is countered as if it was a normal attack.

That was a mis-programming in GSC. Much like back in the RBY days when Ghost wouldn't even hit Psychic even though the chart listed Ghost as Super-Effective against it. In RS, that's no more. I had my Ampharos with HP Fire, and used it against Wobbuffet in Colosseum. Wobbuffet managed to Mirror Coat it, which means that the Type you get is counted as Physical or Special, and not as Normal/Physical. And the STAB is true too. I had the bad luck to have a Espeon with HP Psychic in Colosseum, but it was fairly powerful due to STAB.

[rinku]

HP Normal would never be needed anyway, as any pokémon that can learn HP can learn Return/Frustration for a much better power (apart from any other 70 or better power Normal moves they may learn).

[Gagome]

.... I had my Ampharos with HP Fire, and used it against Wobbuffet in Colosseum. Wobbuffet managed to Mirror Coat it, which means that the Type you get is counted as Physical or Special, and not as Normal/Physical. .....
I can confirm that in FR "Hidden Power Special" can be Countered. My Alakazam fainted after it used HP Ice on a Wobbuffet in Cerulean Cave and Wobbuffet used Counter.
I remember the same happened to me in my Ruby game in Battle Tower against a Wobbuffet. It countered a HP Special Move from one of my Pokemon and I was totally surprised. But I don't remember which move it was. It happened last year.

Maybe Nintendo has fixed this "glitch or feature" in Colosseum?

[Poryhedron]

.... I had my Ampharos with HP Fire, and used it against Wobbuffet in Colosseum. Wobbuffet managed to Mirror Coat it, which means that the Type you get is counted as Physical or Special, and not as Normal/Physical. .....
I can confirm that in FR "Hidden Power Special" can be Countered. My Alakazam fainted after it used HP Ice on a Wobbuffet in Cerulean Cave and Wobbuffet used Counter.
I remember the same happened to me in my Ruby game in Battle Tower against a Wobbuffet. It countered a HP Special Move from one of my Pokemon and I was totally surprised. But I don't remember which move it was. It happened last year.

Maybe Nintendo has fixed this "glitch or feature" in Colosseum?
Or maybe a special-type HP can now be both Countered (because it's a Normal-type move) and Mirror Coated (because it deals special damage)? Can anyone verify the success or failure of Mirror Coat on a special-type HP in RSFL?

[Gagome]

Or maybe a special-type HP can now be both Countered (because it's a Normal-type move) and Mirror Coated (because it deals special damage)? Can anyone verify the success or failure of Mirror Coat on a special-type HP in RSFL?
I have now confirmed that HP can be Countered but not Mirror Coated.
I did this using a link battle between my FR and Ruby games. On both sides I had a Wobbuffet and on FR my Alakazam with HP Ice and on Ruby two Unowns with HP Ghost and HP Dark. At first I tried Mirror Coat on Wob and it failed then Counter and it worked.
I think I will check this in Colosseum too.

About HP getting STAB:

I have a Cradily with HP Grass. I don't remember its IV's but I do remember the attack value was 69 which is pretty decent.
Now I used it's HP Grass against a Wobbuffet. Here is the outcome:

Damage Formula I used:

Damage = ((((2 * Level / 5 + 2) * AttackStat * AttackPower / DefenseStat) / 50) + 2) * STAB * Weakness/Resistance * RandomNumber / 100

RandomNumber is between 85 and 100.

Cradily has SA: 124
Wob has SD: 82
both are at level 50
HP Attack: 69

With the above Formula and STAB damage would be (left value Randomnumber 85, right value Randomnumber 100):

61 - 72

without STAB:

41 - 48

The real damage my Wob got was 67.
So, I think this proves that HP does get STAB.

[Sceptile_Master]

Cool. Thanks a bunch.