I would like to have my deck rated!

[Master Chief]

for people viewing this thread, please be honest, as i have just recently restarted collecting cards again. here are the cards in my deck:

Pokemon

Aerodactyl
Golem
Cradilly
Aggron (2x)
Spinda
Dustox ex
Geodude (3x)
Graveler (2x)
Wurmple (3x)
Cascoon (2x)
Aron (2x)
Lairon (2x)
Lileep (3x)

Trainers

Mysterious Fossil (3x)
Root Fossil (4x)
Power Tree
Bill (2x)

Energies

React Energy (4x)
Double Colourless Energy
Grass Energy (7x)
Fighting Energy (7x)
Water Energy (7x)

Unless im very much mistaken, that equals 60 cards, the accepted limit for a deck. please respond, and be as honest as you can be, so i can make changes to my deck.

[mr_pikachu]

Well, it's worth mentioning that many of these cards can't be used in the Modified format. I'm not sure where you play, but most regions only allow cards from the EX Deoxys set and onwards for general tournament play. Of course, if you just want to play casually, that's probably not a problem.

In terms of deck design... my main recommendation would be to reduce the number of evolution lines in your deck. In general, three or four lines is usually best. I count six here (Aerodactyl, Golem, Cradily, Aggron, Spinda, Dustox). You want versatility, but when you have too many evolutionary lines it becomes hard to draw the cards you need when you need them. This also helps to reduce the number of energies you need. If you can eliminate a type or two, that makes it much easier to power up the Pokemon that are left; consequently, you can put more emphasis on other cards instead of playing 26 energies.

Definitely increase your trainers, by the way. I'm not sure how you plan to play (tournaments or casual), but you ought to consider stuff like Celio's Network and Lanette's Net Search either way, if you can. Look at what trainers you have and see what might help you.

Aside from reducing the number of evo lines and energy types, just look at your cards and see what works together. Then you might consider buying a couple more cards if you need anything in specific to complete a combo or strategy.

[Roarkiller]

As honest as I can, I'd say there's much work to be done. I won't put in a frank comment.

For competitive play, any deck should have an idea based around it, not simply cards thrown together and be expected to work. For example, it could be beatdown, by far the most common idea, where you rally hard-hitting pkmn to do big damage. Or you could go for speed, which is, in competitions nowadays, by far the most important factor. And then there's disruption, where, as the name suggests, you mess up your opponent's game, to make the situation easy for you to win.

Whatever the idea is, decks generally run no more than 4 different pkmn lines MAX. And generally no more than two different evolution lines. So having a bunch of blastoise, pikachu, omanyte, flareon and exploud in your deck ain't gonna cut it. The pkmn also have got to work for each other, or you're gonna end up with pkmn that stops your own pkmn from doing their job.

A good example would be your aerodactyl. That evolves, and the rest of your pkmn can't. And would basically be left for the picking.

Trainers are easier to deal with, generally. You will want cards that help you get cards. Drawing cards like oak, bill, copycat, steven's advice. There are search cards, like computer search, Holon's Researcher, Masterball.

Other trainers are generrally less important, like healing cards, and are up to you or your deck to be included or not.

Energy is one of the biggest problems your deck can have. Too many and you're not gonna be drawing anything else most of the time. Too little and you're gonna have lots of pkmn with no energy to attack. Them drawing trainers will help a lot here, but first you need a good amount to start with. For beginners, I recommend 17 to start of with.

[Master Chief]

thanks for the tips guys, i really appreciate it. but my problem is that i don't have enought cards to do the trick, considering most of my cards i have are from past years (like the double colourless) and the new cards are also mostly from booster packs and 2 decks that i got from a convenince store :P as well, im not used to the new rules, as i have stuck with the old ones for so long. so i would also appreciate it if some one could give me a site where i could review the new rules. again, thanks guys.

[Roarkiller]

You can view all the new rules at the official website, at http://op.pokemon-tcg.com

And the issue isn't the validity of cards. It's the formula itself. You either have too much or too little of everything, so even if you built one with all the recent sets, it wouldn't work.

A sample of a deck (old,so you'd understand):

Pkmn(13)
4 grimer
4 dark muk
3 scyther
2 cleffa

Trainers(33)
4 oak
4 computer search
4 itemfinder
4 gust of wind
3 switch
3 pkmn trader
4 super removal
4 lass
3 nightly garbage run

4 double colorless
10 grass

This deck here is an example of a tournament deck. Notice how most of the cards are included in multiples of 3 or 4. This is to increase the chances of actually obtaining the card. SImply maths really: 1/4 is a better chance than 1/60.

First, the pokemon. Realize that there's only one evolution line: Dark Muk. That's the focus i.e. main attacker, main strategy. The idea is to SUPPORT the main strategy, so that's why additional evolution lines are very rarely included. The other pkmn included are all for support (e.g. scyther has free retreat, is also grass and can attack fast).

Next, the trainers. I think you'll realize that there are a lot of draw and search cards. Oak is by far THE best draw cards ever: it allows you to get a fresh starting hand of 7 cards. Computer search, trader and itemfinder all allow you to get the cards you want pronto. Energy removal and lass are to disrupt your opponent: disturb his rythm and, more importantly, slow him down from winning over you. The rest like gust and switch is for support.

Lastly, the energy. 14 may not work for you at the moment, but for unlimited, this is usually the number (more or less) that winning decks use. It may seem little, but unless you use a pokemon that requires a nuclear reactor to attack (like charizard), this is enough. Remember: you have the DRAW and SEARCH trainers cards to get the energy if you are short of them.

[Master Chief]

WOW! ty for all the help! and ill make sure to check out the website you gave me, cuz i really needed it.

[mr_pikachu]

And that's why RK's the mod here. ^_^

By the way, a deck strategy can focus on more than one evolution line depending on what you play. For instance, one of my favorite decks is a Ludicargo, which focuses mainly on the Ludicolo and Magcargo lines with Plusles for support. The idea is to get at least one Ludicolo and one Magcargo as fast as you can, then combine their abilities to freely search for cards from your deck every turn. Plusle helps to get a lot of basics out quickly, which allows you to save most of your searchers for finding evolutions.

There are a few legitimate decks with three essential elements, but these are few and far between because of how difficult it is to make them work (especially with the existence of Giant Stump, which limits the number of Pokemon in play). A recent example was LBS, which was the ultimate archetype of Pokemon for awhile. The trick was to get Lugia ex and Steelix ex in play and to power them up with Blastoise ex. If that happened, it was incredibly difficult for opponents to even launch a counterattack. That's how powerful the deck was.

Anyway, the point is this. Find a strategy that you want to play, then figure out how to best support it. Once you've got your focus, the rest isn't nearly as difficult.

[Roarkiller]

Was a mod by choice, now a mod by no choice. At least I still play the game, only difference is I now win through ignorance instead of knowledge. Hell, I don't know half the new deck types nowadays, I just smash 'em anyway.

[Master Chief]

lol. i will post all my cards and you guys can help me with what cards to choose to make a relatively good deck. not one that can wipe the board with people, but a good one nonetheless. ty again for helping me out with this.

[homeofmew]

go modified honey dx on plz.
anyway Dustox ex is an annoying pain of a card, make a deck around that

[Master Chief]

ok, i got my cards (all of em) and here they are:

RARES

Delcatty
Aerodactyl [x2]
Spinda
Dragonite [dont have Dragonair]
Entei [reverse holo]
Torkoal [x3]
Magmar
Golem [x2]
Machamp
Solrock
Cradilly [x2]
Vileplume [dont have regular Gloom]
Muk
Pinsir [x3]
Politoed
Kingdra
Lapras
Huntail
Gorebyss [x3]
Aggron [x2]
Gengar
Wobbuffet
Mew
Girafarig
Lunatone
Mewtwo
Raichu
Elekid
Here Comes Team Rocket!
Dustox ex

REGULAR

Meowth [dark]
Dark Persain
Meowth
Persain
Giovanni's Meowth
Blaine's Doduo
Dodrio [dont have regular Doduo]
Skitty [x7]
Trapnich
Vibrava [x2]
Furret [dont have Sentret]
Jigglypuff
Erika's Jigglypuff
Kekleon [x2]
Farfetch'd
Rattata
Rattata [dark]
Lickitung
Dratini
Stantler
Eevee
Dunsparce
Blaine's Vulpix
Vulpix
Ponyta
Dark Rapidash
Magby [x2]
Magmar
Growlithe [x5]
Arcanine
Charmander
Charmeleon
Machop [x8]
Machoke [x3]
Brock's Geodude
Geodude [x8]
Graveler [x3]
Diglett
Sandshrew
Cubone
Marowak
Mankey [x2]
Onix [x3]
Rhyhorn
Rhydon
Exeggcute
Koga's Weedle
Weedle
Caterpie
Metapod
Paras
Parasect
Koffing
Weezing
Koga's Weezing [dont have Koga's Koffing]
Spinarak
Venonat
Nidoran ♀
Nidorina
Nidoran ♂
Nidorino
Giovanni's Nidoran ♂
Ekans
Koga's Zubat
Zubat
Golbat
Grimer [x3]
Bellsprout [x8]
Weepinbell [x5]
Roselia
Seedot [x4]
Tangela
Wurmple [x3]
Cascoon [x3]
Oddish [x2]
Dark Gloom
Bulbasaur
Ivysaur
Wooper
Shellder
Squirtle
Dark Wartortle
Misty's Seel
Seel
Magikarp
Giovanni's Magikarp
Staryu
Starmie
Spheal [x6]
Sealeo [x6]
Clamperl [x7]
Tentacool [x8]
Tentacruel [x3]
Poliwag
Poliwhirl
Misty's Horsea
Horsea
Seadra
Krabby
Kingler
Wailmer [x2]
Goldeen
Seaking
Aron [x3]
Lairon [x2]
Sabrina's Abra
Abra
Jynx
Unknown "U"
Natu
Shuppet
Slowpoke [dark]
Slowpoke [x2]
Slowbro
Sabrina's Drowzee
Drowzee
Wynaut [x5]
Gastly [x7]
Haunter [x2]
Pikachu
Pikachu [promo]
Chinchou [x2]
Voltorb [x4]
Electrode [x2]
Magnemite [x6]

i will post the rest later i g2g to class :(

P.S. this is one hell of a looooooooooooong list, i know

[Master Chief]

i know this is a double post, but here are the rest of my cards:

TRAINERS

Mysterious Fossil [x4]
Omanyte [x6]
Omastar
Kabuto [x3]
Claw Fossil [x7]
Anorith [x4]
Root Fossil [x7]
Lileep [x5]
Energy Retrieval
Energy Removal
Professor Oak [x3]
Pokemon Center
Computer Search
Energy Ark
Fevor
Blaine's Quiz #3
Challenge!
Full Heal
Defender
Gambler
Potion [x13]
Super Potion [x5]
Energy Search [x3]
Switch [x9]
Poke Ball [x2]
Moo-Moo Milk
Super Scoop Up
Bill [x2]
Pokedex
Gust of Wind
Fieldworker [x5]
Giant Stump
Full Flame [x2]
Power Tree [x3]
Cursed Stone
Strange Cave
Saffron City Gym

ENERGIES

React Energy [x7]
Fighting Energy [x41]
Leaf Energy [x32]
Water Energy [x30]
Psychic Energy [x23]
Double Colourless
Fire Energy [x25]
Electric Energy [x13]

ok, that's all of my cards, so i hope you can help me create a deck just for regular battles. again, thanks.

[Roarkiller]

It would have been useful to state which set those cards came from. It would have been especially useful if you had arranged the names to match their evolutions as well, instead of all over the place.

Remember, rarity don't mean no shit when building a deck. It's the playability of the card.

Ah well, can't complain. Just remember that omanyte, omastar, anorith etc aren't trainers. :)

For trainers, these you need to add:

Draw cards
Professor Oak [x3]
Bill [x2]
Fieldworker [x4]

Search cards needs more tho
Computer Search
Challenge!

Assist cards
Gust of Wind (need 3 minimum)
Switch [x4]
Defender
Power Tree [x3]

Healing cards
Potion [x2]
Super Potion [x2]
Full Heal
Super Scoop Up

Disruption
Energy Removal

You have Strange Cave, as well as an abundance of Root Fossil, Lileep and two Cradily, so those can be made to good use. Also see 3 Aron, 2 Lairon and 2 Aggron, so you can build a deck using that as well, although a lack of metal may prevent you from using them (like said, i don't know which sets you're talking about). But you have enough in the Golem family to make a deck, so you might wanna go with that instead.

Assuming that aerodactyl is the fossil version, and assuming you know how to NOT put it down on the bench when your own pkmn have not evolved yet, or if you want to use a pure basic-only deck, you can use that as well.

Basically, for evolution lines, you will be wanting to weed out those that you have multiple copies of. Anything else, like your Arcanine, Seaking, Omastar etc. are pretty much useless.

Then you will want to find good support. I see multiples of pinsir, although it's not exactly a good card, but will do for starters. There's also a lickitung, good for stalling. Any colorless basic with decent HP (60+) and/or good attacks are candidates for support.

Then you just need the energy and you're done. Just remember to try not to use more than 2 different energy types, excluding colorless energy.

[mr_pikachu]

Since when was Challenge! a search card? I used to play it (quite badly, I might add)... if I remember the effect correctly, your opponent could choose whether to let you take a prize or draw two cards. And since they never let you take a prize, it was essentially another Bill.

For another idea - and this depends entirely on what set the cards are - you might be able to tech a Lunarock for certain situations. Of course, if you don't have the right Lunatone and Solrock to disable your opponent's powers, then never mind.

Anyway, would you mind adding the set names (or abbreviations, really) to your list? That'd help quite a bit, at least for the Pokemon.

[Master Chief]

ok, i'll try to get all of the movesets for the pokemon, but it might take a few days, cuz i still have school to go to, you know :P also, the aerodatyl is NOT the fossil type, it is the newer version. Also i just put in the cards the way they were in my binder.

[mr_pikachu]

We don't actually need all the moves; there are databases for that. But if you could give the set names (and in a couple of cases, the card number within the set), then we can identify your cards and figure out what's worth using and what's not.

[Roarkiller]

Lol, we don't need the moveset; just the set from which the card came from, like base, fossil, genesis, skyridge, etc.

And Challenge! doesn't allow you to take a prize, lol. That's Treaty, and BOTH of you draw a prize. What it allows you to do is 1)if opp declines, allow you todraw two cards, or 2)he accepts, BOTH of you search for any number of basic pkmn and place them on the bench.

So it's essentially a search card. In fact, it was one of the cards I experimented with to get a full bench for my infamous Deck of Hell (sneasel/chansey), other than Good Manners, Secret Plan, and now finally Pkmn Fan Club.

[Master Chief]

ok, i will do that when i have the time. reason being, im in a class right now :P and i don't want to get in major trouble lol

[Master Chief]

ok, i made a new deck, tell me what you think of it...

oh, before you do however, i did get new cards as well.

Pokemon
Dustox ex
Rayquaza ex (Promo)
Tyranitar ex (Delta Species)
Meganium Delta Species
Luvdisk
Manectric
Larvitar (x2) Delta Species
Pupitar Delta Species
Wurmple (x3)
Cascoon (x3)
Chikorita (x2) Delta Species
Bayleef Delta Species
Electrike

Trainers
Blaine's Quiz #3
Potion (x5)
Fieldworker (x4)
Pokedex
Moo-Moo Milk
Celio's Network
Energy Search (x3)
Energy Retrieval
Old Rod
Poke Ball
Super Scoop Up
Bill (x2)
Here Comes Team Rocket!

Energies
Double Rainbow Energy
Double Colurless Energy
React Energy (x4)
Fighting Energy (x3)
Leaf Energy (x3)
Fire Energy
Electric Energy (x5)

Alright. that's my whole new deck. tell me if there should be any more changes, because i got around...632 cards in my binder. (i wish i could tell you all of em, but omfg,it is one helluva loooong list)

[mr_pikachu]

Err... why do you have 5 Potions? The limit is 4 for cards other than Basic energies... o_0

Off the top of my head, I'd say your Pokemon lines are spread a little thin. You should probably reduce the number of evolution lines you're playing. Three is usually a good number, although I've seen decks with four. You definitely don't want four full lines, though... that's only playable if most of your lines only go up to stage 1 (or you play some non-evolvers like Rayquaza). The same goes for your Trainers; unless you have ways to search for whatever you need, you ought to reduce the variety of Trainers you play. Otherwise, you'll struggle to get the cards you need when you need them.

I also don't see a strong theme, although I could be missing something since I don't remember all these cards right now. And I'll wait for a confirmation of deck legality before I do further research (i.e. looking up the cards), because you may be changing this list significantly for all I know.


EDIT: Unless I've miscounted, there are only 58 cards in this deck. You need 60.

[Master Chief]

nope, there's 60 cards in there...unless im supposed to take away that extra potion..then that's 59.

[Roarkiller]

Pokemon(19)
3x Wurmple
3x Cascoon
1x Dustox ex
2x Chikorita Delta Species
1x Bayleef Delta Species
1x Meganium Delta Species
2x Larvitar Delta Species
1x Pupitar Delta Species
1x Tyranitar ex (Delta Species)
1x Manectric
1x Electrike
1x Rayquaza ex (Promo)
1x Luvdisk

Trainers(23)
1x Blaine's Quiz #3
4x Fieldworker
2x Bill
1x Celio's Network
3x Energy Search
1x Poke Ball
1x Pokedex
5x Potion
1x Moo-Moo Milk
1x Super Scoop Up
1x Energy Retrieval
1x Old Rod
1x Here Comes Team Rocket!

Energies(18)
3x Fighting Energy
3x Leaf Energy
1x Fire Energy
5x Electric Energy
1x Double Rainbow Energy
1x Double Colurless Energy
4x React Energy


There. That's easier to read. Unfortunately, your sets printed (where available) are wrong. There's no T-tar ex nor meganium line in DS. I'm guessing Unseen Forces.

And unfortunately, I believe I did mention the importance of having multiples of each card. If you look above, you'll see a lot of (1x) beside the cards, and that's very bad. Not so bad for trainers, but VERY bad for pkmn.

Start off by checking if you have more than one copy of the FINAL evolution e.g. more than one T-tar, more than one megamium, etc. If you only have one, then ditch it, it ain't gonna be useful.

Next step is to check if you have the same number or more copies of it's previous evolutions. Like if you have 2 seaking, make sure you have 2 or more goldeen, and if you have 2 dustox, you must have 2 or more cascoon and wurmple each.

I think this two steps should narrow down your choices to a very select few, no? Start from there.

[Master Chief]

T-tar ex and Meganium are from the Dragon Frontiers booster packs. also, instead of the ex cards i have, how about x2 of Aggron and Cradilly?

EDIT: i almost forgot about my x2 of Golem set.

[Roarkiller]

You also have 3 tentacruel, although if that's the fossil version, then forget it. Cradily's a good choice. Like I said, you also have 3 pinsir there, and a lickitung for good measure.

If possible, trade for some good cheap cards. Base chameleon is one good one, as is base arcanine. There are tons of non-rare cards that work better than rare cards, like Lt.surge's raticate, and seaking.

[Master Chief]

nah, the tentacruel i have are as follows:

1x Tentacruel (fossil?)
2x Tentacruel (Legend Makers set)

EDIT: the 2 Aggron i have can now finally work! reason being, i have the double rainbow energy.

[mr_pikachu]

Two might be enough for a side line, although you wouldn't want to make it a primary focal point of your deck.

Out of curiosity, which Aerodactyl do you have? If it's the right one (although I can't remember what set it was in), you might be able to play a deck that revolves around suppressing your opponent's evolutions... it would be nice to have at least three copies if that is your main focus, though.

Also, a good search card to add to Roar's list would be Itemfinder, if you can find one cheap. Cards like VS Seeker and a few of the Holon Engine cards might also be good, as long as you have the right stuff to use them effectively - in these cases, you'll probably want supporters and Delta Species Pokemon.

[Master Chief]

i have the Legend Makers version of Aerodactyl, but i only have two of em T_T i recently have found out where i can buy two decks for $2 Canadian. XD i might be able to get some more pkmn with trainers (i do have itemfinder, but only one of it)

[mr_pikachu]

If you try to get Itemfinder, don't bother buying packs. You'll have to buy a lot of them, since it was a rare when it was printed. Just see if you can buy one (or more) cheaply, or make good trades. The same goes for stuff like Computer Search.

On the other hand, if you use a lot of Delta Species cards, the Holon Engine might be better. Of course, first you'd have to get the necessary cards. Unless, of course, you have them already... but I'm writing a report right now and honestly can't be bothered to look back through the list. ^_^;;

[Master Chief]

lol don't bother then, just take your time.

[Roarkiller]

Cradily/tentacruel combo sounds like your best bet. There's ample support pokemon for the deck anyhow, and you're limiting to only two types, and only two evo lines.

[Master Chief]

cool. even though i already made the deck (still got my ex combo deck) i think i'll try out that deck.

[homeofmew]

you need more draw and trainer cards.

[Master Chief]

i replaced the Meganium set in my first deck with a Skitty, a Delcatty, a Clamperl and a Huntail. they're not for battling, just for helping me get React Energies and putting them onto other Pokemon.

EDIT: and getting several Pokemondecks won't be a problem, cuz i found a shop where i can buy 2 decks for $2 Canadian. Lucky me!! :)

[Master Chief]

ok, just wondering, what kind of deck would support a Latios ex delta species (water type)?

also, i now have two Double Rainbow Energies at my disposal to use with my 2x Aggron, so now my deck looks like this:

1x Rayquaza ex
1x Electrike
1x Larvitar delta species
1x Pupitar delta species
1x Tyranitar ex delta species
2x Aron
2x Lairon
2x Aggron
1x Wurmple
1x Cascoon
1x Dustox ex
2x Potion
2x Bill
2x Giant Stump
3x Energy Search
3x Switch
3x Fieldworker
1x Pokedex
1x Energy Retrieval
1x Energy Removal
1x Moo-Moo Milk
1x Poke Ball
1x Celio's Network
1x Dual Ball
1x Old Rod
1x Island Hermit (VERY helpful)
2x Super Potion
1x Holon Legacy
1x Blaine's Quiz #3
1x Super Scoop Up
1x Energy Ark
2x Double Rainbow Energy
1x Fire Energy
1x Boost Energy (provides 3 Colourless Energy)
3x Grass Energy
4x Electric Energy
4x React Energy
1x Double Colourless Energy

[mr_pikachu]

Well, your trainers are still spread very thin. I think you'll find that it will be difficult to get the card you need when you need it if you've only got one copy of it in your entire deck. That sort of tactic only works for decks that revolve around extensive searching, and even then it's usually not done to quite such an extreme.

I'd ouright drop most of the cards that rely on luck. Dual Ball is decent enough since you have two chances at it (and since it's not a Supporter), but Pokeball and Super Scoop Up are really risky. I'd prefer a regular Scoop Up over the latter; its effect isn't too much worse, and it works every time.

Retrieval/Removal are fine, but they're the sort of cards that should have multiple copies if you use them at all. (One of the most frustrating games I ever played was against a guy who used 4 Removals and 4 Super Removals, which made it really hard to get anything going. That's a major control deck.) So you should probably either add more or drop them, as it doesn't do much good to just have one.

In fact, that sums up a lot of the cards you have here (except for the ones that aren't worthwhile anyway and which should simply be dropped). I would keep Hermit, because it's a strong card that will help you regardless of its number. Ideally, you would want multiple copies of it, but leave the one copy in your deck even if you don't have extras.

In general, do the same thing you did with the Pokemon. Reduce the variety of trainers and pack multiple copies of the ones that remain. That will make it immensely more likely for you to get the right cards at the right time.

[Master Chief]

wow. that's all i can say. wow.


ok, that's not all i can say. i completly agree with you on having only 1 Poke Ball and SSU, and if i had doubles of my ex cards, i'd put them in my deck, but unfortunatly, i don't. fortunatly, i have doubles of the Cradilly, Golem, and Aggron sets. Can you tell me what the best kind of deck i can make with those cards?

oh, and my queston about where my new Latios ex can go is still unanswered :P

EDIT: get the Unfortunatly, Fortunatly, idea? XD

[Roarkiller]

I take it, from the deck, that you're referring to Aggrom, Golem and Cradily from Legend Makers.

In which case, Aggron and Golem deck, since they both use fighting energy. You don't need so many evolutions in your deck, these two lines give your a total of 14 pkmn already if you use a 3-2-2 line (basic-1st-2nd stage). All you need then are some strong basics, like Lickitung and Erika's Jigglypuff.