British Local Elections: May 3rd 2007

[Weasel Overlord]

So! Since we British people seem to be swamped with American politics (which I for one just can't get my head round) I figured I'd make my own topic about our upcoming Local Elections.

So, some general info, perhaps? On British politics, in case people are unsure.

We have three "major" parties; Labour, Conservative, and Liberal Democrat; the first being Left wing, the second Right wing, and the third being Centre-Left wing. Since I'm generally biased towards my own party, I won't explain anything more about these three, as my information would be skewed by my own opinions. ^_^

There are also a few more parties which are generally thought to have no chance at getting into power; the main two (I think) being the Green Party, and the BNP, or British National Party. (which I also won't talk about, since I despise everything they stand for)

I myself am a Green Party supporter. I'll be faithfully standing my vote in May, as I have done for the last two years. One of my main reasons is the fact that Green is the only party to have an actual Animal Rights proposal, as well as their opposition of nuclear power.

My question is this; Who will you be voting for, and why? What do you think of the current situation with the BNP's rising popularity? Is Blair really so bad, and will Gordon Brown be any better?

Fancy a rant about Labour? Join meeee! Also, I'm just curious as to the party support among people my own age, since I don't know many people who actually use their votes.

So! Discuss! Or something. (feel free to ask questions if you are a confused American ^_^)

[mr_pikachu]

I am a confused American! I have questions!

...Yeah.

So, American politics right now are fairly bipolar between the left and right wings. So, can you explain what issues distinguish the Labour (ugh, the "u" is so Ye Olde English) party from the Liberal Democrats? I'm curious.

[firepokemon]

Oh no a greenie. yuck, yuck, yuck. What is so bad about nuclear power anyway? I come from NZ which is very anti-nuclear but I really don't mind it at all. I'm also very anti-green party because its my opinion they're nothing but nannying politically correct weirdos. Sorry, but thats how I feel.

And what is their animal rights proposal anyway? No hunting deer or something?

And when you say local elections are you meaning councils, ie. the voting of mayors or something???

[Weasel Overlord]

I'd say "yay, people!!" but one of them just insulted my political beliefs. Firepokemon, dude, I don't want any flame-baiting in my topic. Not like I care what you say about my party anyway, I'm used to people taking the piss out of me supporting them. ^_^

Questions! Yayers! Okay, Mr. P;

Labour, as we have all seen, supported British participation in Iraq, whereas the Lib Dems opposed it from the beginning, and support withdrawal from Iraq.

This (http://www.labour.org.uk/ourpolicies) is a list of Labour's policies in much more detail than I can give, and according to the font of eternal knowledge that is Wiki;


Since the election of Tony Blair, the New Labour hierarchy have deliberately courted Conservative voters and even Conservative politicians on the basis that if they take the centre ground from the other parties, they gain power. In part they are able to do this because their own voters have nowhere to turn to the left of New Labour. Thus in recent years the Lib Dems have tried to a degree to accommodate these people, by adopting or at least making public, more social liberal (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_liberalism) policies.

As for your questions, fp;

Nuclear power is unsafe, expensive and dangerous to the environment. Not only that, but I'm certain you remember events such as Chernoble, and Three Mile Island. Can you truly tell me that nuclear plants are safe?

The animal rights policies of the Green party are as follows;

-Opposing factory farming and advocating the banning of cruel live exports
-An end to animal experimentation, and real investment in non-animal chemical testing
-Vaccination against future outbreaks of foot-and-mouth, rather than culling
-Campaigning against the trade in meat from endangered species, import of dog and cat fur, intensive factory farming and towards the ending of live animal imports

[firepokemon]

Nuclear power is unsafe, expensive and dangerous to the environment. Not only that, but I'm certain you remember events such as Chernoble, and Three Mile Island. Can you truly tell me that nuclear plants are safe?

While nuclear power can be expensive is is a relatively safe use of electricity. As a green you would be aware of greenhouse gases??? Nucclear does not use greenhouse gases the only forseeable problem is the storage of nuclear waste, that I would agree is an issue. As for Chenoble that was an unfortunate incident but should be looked at, as taking place in a country that does not have the rigurous safety and maintenace checks that a place such as the United States or Britain does. Therefore they really can't be used because that is an extreme case. And while deadly it should not be the norm. Nuclear power is therefore a great way of providing electricty without using greenhouse gases. Surely a supporter of the Green Party wants to see less greenhouse gases used.



The animal rights policies of the Green party are as follows;

-Opposing factory farming and advocating the banning of cruel live exports
-An end to animal experimentation, and real investment in non-animal chemical testing
-Vaccination against future outbreaks of foot-and-mouth, rather than culling
-Campaigning against the trade in meat from endangered species, import of dog and cat fur, intensive factory farming and towards the ending of live animal imports

What exactly is factory farming? Are talking piggeries? caged chickens? intensive dairy farms?

An end to all animal experimentation? I don't agree but its an issue where you can't really argue about, because while I see a need, its still horrible.

Vaccinations are expensive? If animals already have foot and mouth disease, the only thing that can be done is to cull the animals to prevent the spread of such a dangerous disease. A vaccination needs to take place beforehand and that would likely be expensive and I would question whether such a vaccination exists. Surely a much better policy would be research into foot and mouth and possible drug and preventitive measures.

[Weasel Overlord]

As a Green, of course I want less greenhouse gases. What you don't take into consideration is the fact that there are other energy sources which are not only renewable, but clean too. I speak of solar power, wave power and wind turbines here. While people may complain about wind farms being an unsightly blemish on the land, a more unsightly blemish is a disused nuclear plant, with its festering waste dumpage and the sheer amount of time it would take to clean up such a site.

I used Chernoble and Three Mile as examples to back up my main argument, so don't leap on them as weaknesses. I'm perfectly aware that "safety measures" and so on have been installed.

Factory farming is where an animal, (let's use a chicken for an example, as battery farming is probably the most well-known case) is kept in a tiny cage with no room to move around in. These cages are stacked on top of one-another, literally driving the birds mad with the close proximities to other birds. The feet of these chickens are often malformed, as they are cramped up in the tiny metal-wired cages, and the bird will experience intense mental discomfort at the lack of fresh air, sunlight and simply space to move around and scratch.

If our government wasn't so intent on spending millions of pounds restoring nuclear power, then vaccines wouldn't be thought of as so expensive. Culling is the "easier" option for people who don't want to find a more humane way of going about things.

For now, I am tired and going to bed. Keep this to a discussion on the parties rather than an attack on my beliefs, firepokemon.

[firepokemon]

Its not an attack on your beliefs. I just said I dont particularly like the green party, surely that should not reflect on you personally. And since you've mentioned green policies I happen not to agree with them but I will grant you one thing. I don't believe much in this free range stuff but I do think that there needs to be at least some action on caged chickens. For starters stop the so cramp conditions, but again they need not be free range either.

[Ultimate Charizard]

Unfortunately as with any debate, political or otherwise there will always be others that see things differently. The initial reaction to which is surprise that they cant see such an obvious point (whatever the point is your trying to make) and is then followed by trying to explain your point which leads to people being accused of 'forcing opinions' on people.
Personally i stay out of Politics. It doesnt interest me. All of the parties say what people want to hear untill theyre elected into power and then go off on their own agenda once theyre in. One of the party leaders is currently on a 'eco-friendly push' by showing up for work on his bike etc in a bid to lure the Green party supporters that want to vote for a party that could actually win (to be fair WO, that is how you described them above), and then spends half the year flying around on his private jet.

Untill they actually start doing things that people want rather than just getting power and seeing what they can do with it then i have very little interest in whos running what cos as far as i can see theyre all the same.

Now as for the BNP. For those not in the know the BNP are about as close to Nazi ideals as you can get these days while being an acceptable political party. Theyre a 'Britain for Britains' type of party who target working class voters who are most affected by the influx of Foreign workers. As it stands as soon as another country joins the EU they head straight to the UK and claim asylum/citizenship to benefit from higher pay, state benefits and the Free NHS. Basically a better standard of living but it has a knock on effect (at least so say the BNP) that young British families cant get homes because the immigrants have them. Government money is being wasted on housing and education etc for them and theyre a general leech on society. (Basically how the US think of Mexican immigrants except here theyre legal)
Now to a certain degree i do agree with what theyre trying to say and that theyre general point that the seemingly uncontrolled immigration is a problem that the current government seems happy to ignore. However theyre methods are a just plain wrong. Theyre starting to hit borderline racism and indeed when theyre party leader was tried on a Racism charge they chose the best way to celebrate him being found not guilty would be to crack open champagne outside the courthouse and act like a bunch of rowdy idiots.

Anyway. Like i said the overall outcome doesnt really bother me but i am interested in others opinions.

[Chris]

I think Labour, Conservatives and the BNP are the only parties fielding candidates in my ward. Even though I can't stand Labour I have to vote for them to keep the BNP from getting the seat.

I fucking hate politics, and I hate the way that Labour have simply made a huge PR game out of it.

[Blademaster]

I am a confused, hyperactive American with ADHD and I just finished my third Dr. Pepper! I don't have the time or patience to read all these long posts!

Fair weasly maiden, can you please summarize all this legal mumbo-jumbo in, say... one sentence? :D

...Please? Pleeeeeeease? C'mon, you OWE me!

[Ultimate Charizard]

ill give it a go..

"British Politics has all the credibility of Big Brother"

[Emotional Faun Chiko-sai]

Well I'm a confused Asian. ^^;; and I don't even know which party Tony Blair's from, go me...
I think the rights you greenies campaign for are good and lovely, but the chance of them actually happening/materializing in the flesh (so to speak) is kinda low DD:
And I do think politicians are liars, even more so than writers :x

[Weasel Overlord]

Blair's with Labour, lol.

Well, I'd hardly say that we were a Big Brother society, UC. Even if they are wanting to bring in ID cards, we've still a long LONG way to go from totalitarianism.

And I completely agree with you there, Emo-sai. I think I vote Green for the sheer morality of it, since they're the only party who have halfway decent animal rights stuff. (Yes, I harp on about animal rights, lol. I believe fully in them, hehe.)

I remember last year, the BNP kept pushing leaflets through our letterbox at home, and I honestly couldn't believe the racism I read in them. It might not be obvious at a first glance, but all they talked about was stopping illegal immigrants getting into the country and "stealing our jobs and houses" blah blah. Obviously the ridiculous increase in housing prices lately is nothing to do with why young families can't afford to buy... [/end sarcasm]

Chris, that really, really sucks man. I'm lucky to live in a ward with Green candidates, I guess. And apparently, Lancaster (which is where I'm at uni) is a Green-dominated constituency! I never knew that, lol.

And sorry if I sounded snappy, firepokemon. It was late, lol, and I was tiredy.

[AntiAsh Superstar]

Myself I'll prolly be voting Conservative this time around, basically coz I'm sick of the current Labour government and fail to see how the Conservatives could mess things up any more. I'm deeply sceptical of *any* political party but as power corrupts and *anyone* in power will be subject to the whole being beaten between big businesses and politically correct research but meh... I'll vote for whoever actually stands a chance of changing the current government. Lib Dems would be an option if... I dunno, every single election result in the past ever wasn't taken into account, personally I'd rather vote for them but I know they stand a snowballs chance in hell of being elected.

So yeah, my voting strategy is 'better the devil you DON'T know, how can it be worse?'. :)

[Chris]

So yeah, my voting strategy is 'better the devil you DON'T know, how can it be worse?'. :)

http://img354.imageshack.us/img354/7668/503pxthatcherlocrl1.jpg

All joking aside, this is probably the best chance that the Conservatives have had in a long time. A couple of weeks ago David Cameron was pretty much level with Tony Blair in the opinion polls.

[AntiAsh Superstar]

http://img354.imageshack.us/img354/7668/503pxthatcherlocrl1.jpg

All joking aside, this is probably the best chance that the Conservatives have had in a long time. A couple of weeks ago David Cameron was pretty much level with Tony Blair in the opinion polls.

The scary thing being that if I was David Cameron I'd take that as a serious insult.
I try as best as I can be to be impartial as someone whose voting strategy amounts to 'they're all crap but let's throw a random vote to the party who haven't been in power for a while'... and to that effect I do wonder how David Cameron fares in the poularity stakes to Gordon Brown as shurely he's the one he'lll be facing in the elections?

[Kris]

With the last general election I voted Liberal as they wanted to get rid of student tuition fees which I thought was great :D But now I dont know who to go for as Ill be long gone from uni before tuition fees are got rid of (if liberal get in).

Anyone got a dummies guide to what they are 'offering' as such? Definately dont want labour though!