The Bouncing Wumpus AEther Show! (aka rate Red's Magic deck)

[Red Angel]

Ok, I started playing Magic 3 weeks ago, and, 3 preconstructed decks and $5 worth of singles later, I've come up with a somewhat decent (IMHO) deck.

Green
2x Tribal Forcemage
2x Vine Trellis
4x Llanowar Elves
4x Hunted Wumpus
4x Naturalize

Blue
4x Counterspell
2x Wash Out
4x (card drawing)*

Multicolored
2x AEther Mutation
2x Jungle Barrier

Artifact
3x Wizard Replica
4x AEther Spellbomb

Land
13x Forest
11x Island

Ok, I'm not sure what kind of card drawing I should use, but I've looked at the stuff I can get (common or uncommon) in the last couple of sets and found the following:

---------------------------------------------

Concentrate
2UU, Sorcery, Odyssey Uncommon
Draw three cards.

Standstill
1U, Enchantment, Odyssey Uncommon
When a player plays a spell, sacrifice Standstill. If you do, then each of that player's opponents draws three cards.

Rush of Knowledge
4U, Sorcery, Scourge Common
Draw cards equal to the highest converted mana cost among permanents you control.

Inspiration
3U, Instant, 8th Edition Common
Target player draws two cards.

Treasure Trove
2UU, Enchantment, 8th Edition Uncommon
2UU: Draw a card.

Thoughtcast
4U, Sorcery, Mirrodin Common
Affinity for artifacts (This spell costs 1 less to play for each artifact you control.) Draw two cards.

---------------------------------------------

Treasure Trove and Thoughtcast look nice (if I use Thoughcast, I'll add 4x Seat of the Synod and 4x Tree of Tales in place of some Forests and Islands for a total of 15 artifacts).

Anyway, the basic idea is to use Llanowar Elves and the Vine Trellis to accelerate to a turn-3 Hunted Wumpus, and then bounce whatever they play with AEther Spellbomb (or if they play a fattie, use AEther Mutation to net myself some tokens in the process). Jungle Barriers (along with Vine Trellis) provide blocking power and a free card. Trinal Forcemage prevents them from chump-blocking my Wumpus, or i can boost itself and the Wizard Replicas to hit the non-flying opponent for those last few points of damage. Wash Out is excelent against people not playing Green, and Counterspell is just fun. Finally, Wizard Replicas provide additional countermagic as well as an answer to flying weenies.

Anyway, please make some suggestions (especially on the subject of card drawing), and try to avoid sugesting too many rares. Thanks in advance.

[Razola]

I'll have to assume this is casual.

If you go with Thoughtcast:

-2 Jungle Barrier
+2 Steel Wall
-2 Wash Out
+2 Thirst for Knowledge

If you go with Rush of Knowledge:

-4 Hunted Wumpus
+4 Myr Enforcer
(Add Artifacts lands as well)

I'm still trying to figure out the kill condition of the deck. Hunted Humpus is a fairly sub-par card, and he's the only big creature you have. Should he get Terrored, you're relying on a few small creatures to win.

[Alec Trevelyan]

on this 4 card drawing i'd suggest fact or fiction, this rlz!

[Razola]

He didn't mention if he had it or not, but you certainly should be using FoF if you got it!

[Red Angel]

Originally posted by Raz
I'll have to assume this is casual.

If you go with Thoughtcast:

-2 Jungle Barrier
+2 Steel Wall
-2 Wash Out
+2 Thirst for Knowledge

If you go with Rush of Knowledge:

-4 Hunted Wumpus
+4 Myr Enforcer
(Add Artifacts lands as well)

I'm still trying to figure out the kill condition of the deck. Hunted Humpus is a fairly sub-par card, and he's the only big creature you have. Should he get Terrored, you're relying on a few small creatures to win.

This IS casual (i'm not good enough to enter tourneys, especially with all the freaking turn-3 kills running around). This isn't an artifact deck, though, but I might add the Stell Walls. I'm keeping the Wumpus because too many people are running artifact decks, and I love using something that nobody else is. If I had it, I'd be using either Stroke of Genius / Fact or Fiction, but I have neiter.

[Razola]

I'll let you know when I see a viable Turn 3 kill in Type 2.

If you want to run artifact-hate, a red/green deck with Molder Slugs and Ischron Scepters loaded with Naturalizes and Scepters will always make you the least popular guy in your play group.

[Red Angel]

Originally posted by Raz
I'll let you know when I see a viable Turn 3 kill in Type 2.

And I'll let you know when I actually SEE anyone in my area play Type 2. It's eiter Extended or Booster Draft over here, Raz. And as for 3-tun kills, here's one that, while it took several turns longer 4 or 5, it absolutely humiliated me:

I'm sitting there with a pair of 1/1 elves, looking forward to massive life gain with Wellwishers. My opponent's been playing nothing but lands for the last 3 turns, so I'm looking forward to having some fun with Wellwishers and Heedless ones. On turn 4, he goes balistic. He casts a Blistering Firecat (7/1 1RRR trample haste, dies at end of turn). I don’t block, since a pair of 1/1 Elves isn’t going to help me. Turn 5, he does something like Dark Ritual (or 2), revives his Firecat, and casts Ball Lighning (6/1 RRR trample haste, dies at end of turn). I didn’t even bother blocking them. Good game. See?


Originally posted by Raz

If you want to run artifact-hate, a red/green deck with Molder Slugs and Ischron Scepters loaded with Naturalizes and Scepters will always make you the least popular guy in your play group.

Sceptrers are so freaking hard to get it's not funny. Nobody has them, everybody wants them, and if somebody is willing to trade you one, it'll cost you an arm, a leg, and both eyes :D. Seriously, though, no credit card = no Scepter. Period.

I never said I wanted to run arti-hate... I juat said that some of the suggestions were making my deck too artifact-y, and i wanted to avoid that because too many players are running them.

Also, any thoughts on flying control? I keep getting my @$$ handed to me by stupid 1-mana (after affinity) Somber Hovergards, and it's REALLY starting to bruise my self-esteem. Any thought? I'm thinking Claws of Wirewood (3 damage to all flyers and players). It's sorta cheap, it's common, and it cycles.

[Chrisodeo]

-1 Jungle Barrier
-1 Vine Trellis

+2 Wall of Air

Wall of Air is an underrated card. 1UU for a 1/5 wall with Flying = leetage. Underrated too. Alternately, you can put in Hidden Spider, Hurricane (I have a liking for blowing everyone up), or something of the sort. Looks like it'll work. I don't see why people are whining about the small amount of big creatures, but the walls and such should stall enough.

Also, come on. Scepters aren't that hard to find.

[Razola]

Originally posted by Chrisodeo
Wall of Air is an underrated card. 1UU for a 1/5 wall with Flying = leetage. Underrated too. Alternately, you can put in Hidden Spider, Hurricane (I have a liking for blowing everyone up), or something of the sort. Looks like it'll work. I don't see why people are whining about the small amount of big creatures, but the walls and such should stall enough.


Because if he loses all his Wumpi, then he's screwed. And the Wumpus is not a good kill condition. You play Wumpus and they play...Nekrataal or Faceless Butcher. And Heaven help you if they play a Duplicant. Nothing like a free 6/6 Beast Shapeshifter for your buddy.

The deck is creative, but its premise is way too shakey. A nice green beatdown deck with a splash of blue for control would work wonders.

And Wall of Air is perfectly rated. Low. Unless they do something (or are very cheap like Steel Wall) Walls are fairly worthless. The exception is walls that are cantrips. Psychic Membrane gives you a card when it blocks and Jungle Barrier digs into your deck when it hits the table. Wall of Hope does double duty, being a cheap wall that provides life gain when it dies. It's almost like a 0/6 for W.

I'd consider adding 4 Walls of Mulch to the deck (keep the Jungle Barriers if you life). They offer decent defense and when they die they can help speed up your deck.

[Red Angel]

I might try making this into a mainly green beast deck with a bit of blue for bouncing stuff, and maybe the Thought dinner family :D (Nibbler, Eater, Devourer), plus Krosan Warchief and Canoypy Crawler and Thresher Beast. Anything else you guys would care to suggest?

Also, nobody gave me an oppinion on Claws of Wirewood... is it worthwhile, or should I try using more flyers?

[Razola]

That sounds cool.

Through in Contested Cliffs, Brooooooodstar, and a lot of artifacts to make a interesting deck.

Fava Beans

3 Thought Eater
3 Thought Devourer
4 Krosan Warchief
2 Ravenous Baloth
4 Vine Trellis (or Birds of Paradise if you got them)
2 Clockwork Vorrac
2 Broodstar

2 Spellbook
4 Talisman of Impulse
4 Mana Leak
2 Æther Spellbomb
4 Thoughtcast

4 Seat of the Synod
4 Tree of Tales
4 Glimmervoid
2 Contested Cliffs
6 Forest
4 Island

[Red Angel]

I like the thought, but that deck is packing too many (13) rares. With my financial situation (part-time jobs are almost as hard to come by as Scepters), I'd much rather run a cheap deck. Here's my initial idea... any thoughts?

4x Hunted Wumpus
4x Krosan Warchief
4x Canopy Crawler
4x Vine Trellis
2x Tribal Forcemage

3x Claws of Wirewood
4x AEther Spellbomb
4x (some other one-blue-mana bounce spell)
4x Rush of Knowlege

15x Forest
10x Island

Yes, I know it's abysmal as it stands. On the bright side, I have the only two rares it uses (the Forcemages) and a large prtion of the other cards, so it shouldn't be too hard to put together.

[Razola]

Easy, tournament-worthy deck is Affinity. The most basic build requires 2 rares (which are available in pre-cons!):

4 Frogmite
4 Myr Enforcer
2 Broodstar

4 Thoughtcast
2 or 4 Thirst for Knowledge
0 or 2 Rush of Knowledge
3 Override
3 Disperal Shield/Mana Leak/Assert Authority (whatever you got)
2 Æther Spellbomb
4 Pyrite Spellbomb
4 Welding Jar
2 Tendrils of Agony/Shrapnel blast
2 Lightning Greaves
2 Talisman of Dominance
2 Talisman of Indulgence

4 Seat of the Synod
4 Vault of Whispers
4 Great Furnance
8 Island

Two rares, and it works like a charm. Amaze your friends and family! And you can get like half of in the U/B pre-con!

[Red Angel]

<imagines someone playing shatterstorm agianst that deck>

Ahem... anyway, as mcuh as I like the idea, I'm not planing enter any tourneys in the near future, so I'd rather have fun...

<saves Raz's decklist for future reference>

Anyway, clould you make some suggestions/fixes/whatever to my most recent idea? I'd greatly appreciate it.

<wonders if people have such a dislike of Claws of Wirewood that they won't even rate it>

[Razola]

Let's do a quick run down.

First the theme is obvious. Break the Wumpus's drawback by bouncing whatever the opponent played. By why is this deck using blue? Why not just get rid of the threat permanently (or at least more permanent than bounce)? Black is an obvious choice. Bait out their good creatures and kill them off.

4x Hunted Wumpus
4x Krosan Warchief
4x Canopy Crawler
4x Vine Trellis
2x Tribal Forcemage

No to the Forcemage. Yes to critters like Nekrataal, Faceless Bucther, Boneshredder, and Duplicant (several of those not rare). Don't bother with a beast theme, just go with mana accel. Lanowar Elves, and Vine Trellis. Get that Wumpus out fast. I would:

-2 Forcemage
-4 Canopy Crawler
-4 Warchief
-2 Trellis
+4 Faceless Bucther
+4 Nekrataal
+4 Lanowar Elf
+4 Leaden Myr

3x Claws of Wirewood
4x AEther Spellbomb
4x (some other one-blue-mana bounce spell)
4x Rush of Knowlege

Understand that your deck want to get out a big creature fast, so no to Rush (which is for decks that get High CC creatures out fast). So:

-4 Bounce Spell X
-3 Claws of Wirewood
-4Spellbomb
-4 Rush
+4 Terror
+1 Dark Banishing
+3 Cabal Therapy (Let's you peek to see if its safe to play Wumpus, if not flashback and get the fattie!)
+4 Predator's Strike

15x Forest
10x Island

Obviously we'll need to tweak this. Your no-rare policy will make for a shakey mana base, though.

-4 Forest
-10 Island
+13 Swamp

FINAL DECK

Hunting Wabbits

3 Faceless Bucther
3 Nekrataal
4 Lanowar Elf
4 Leaden Myr
4 Wumpus
2 Vine Trellis

4 Terror
2 Innocent Blood
1 Zombify
2 Cabal Therapy
3 Predator's Strike
2 Lightning Greaves

13 Forest
13 Swamp

Your basic strategy is to lay down some myrs and elves to gets a mana base going, then prepare for a Wumpus Attack. Cabal Therapy or have a terror or Innocent Blood ready. Then attack with Wumpus!

[Red Angel]

Me likes, me likes, Raz.

Any suggestions on a good precon with most of these? Or is there none?

[Razola]

Cabal Therapy might be hard to find, being a popular card in Vintage decks. It's a Judgment card, and sadly there were no Black pre-cons for that set.

Wizards has the contents of their pre-cons on their website. Go here (http://www.magicthegathering.com) and then go to products and look up the pre-cons.

Here's a list of some of the sets:

Butcher: Torment
Nekrataal: Visions, but reprinted in 8th, so look there first.
Vine Trellis: Mercadian Masques and 8th.
Lanowar Elves: Just about every damn core set made (except 8th).
Lightning Greaves: Mirrodin
Terror: Everywhere.
Innocent Blood: Odessey
Zombify: 8th
Preadtor's Strike: Mirrodin

Should you find yourself getting rares, keep and eye out for more effective creature kill and mana producer (Birds of Paradise over Elves and Utopia Trees over Trellis or Myr). Apocolypse has a Black/Green land rare that would also be useful. Tempting Wurm is a creature similar to Wumpus, but much risker (allowing your opponent to play any permanents in his or her hand) and might not be wise to have too many off. Persecute (in 8th) is a very nice rare. I could see dropping a therapy for one or two.

And hey, this deck has NO rares. Go me.

[Red Angel]

Ok, I've had a lok at the card you suggested (I had no clue what some of them did), and some of them just seem... bad. Faceless Butcher is realy bad, IMHO, with stupid SHock/Elecrostatic Bolt/Terror/other stuff, it won't keep the removed creature from the game for long... wouldn't another Nekraraal and a few Dark Banishiongs be better? Also, why the Cabal Therapy? 7th has two very nice alternatives, namely Duress and Ostracize, which fulfil the same role, but with a higher chance of discarding something...

Well, I did a little re-tooling, so take a look

4 Nekrataal
4 Lanowar Elf
4 Leaden Myr
4 Wumpus
2 Vine Trellis

4 Terror
2 Dark Banishing
2 Duress
2 Ostracize
1 Zombify
3 Predator's Strike
2 Lightning Greaves

13 Forest
13 Swamp

A little ligher on the creature size, but I think that the hand disruption/creature kill is now a bit stronger.

[Razola]

1) You can't Terror Faceless Butcher
2) They can feel free to waste two shocks or two electrostatic bolts on the Butcher. In order to get back their creature they had to waste two cards. You gain some card advantage.
4) Dark Banishing can't block or attack. You won't have enough creatures in the deck without the Butcher. The Butcher can also target black creatures.
5) If the Butcher is still unappealing to you, Bone Shredder is another option. Though it's more expensive than Butcher (it has echo), it comes down a turn earlier and is less black-intensive. It's much weaker though (a 1/1).
6) Or you can have 2 of each. Play shredder, then target it with the Butcher. When the butcher dies your opponent loses another creatue.
7) Duress is a very good card, but it cannot discard creatures.
8) Cabal Therapy is reuseable and more flexible than Ostracize. If your opponent has a Wrath of God but no fatties, you can Therapy that and then drop the Wumpus.

[Red Angel]

Originally posted by Raz
1) You can't Terror Faceless Butcher
silly me :D
2) They can feel free to waste two shocks or two electrostatic bolts on the Butcher. In order to get back their creature they had to waste two cards. You gain some card advantage.
Ok, I guess you've got a point
4) Dark Banishing can't block or attack. You won't have enough creatures in the deck without the Butcher. The Butcher can also target black creatures.
That's true... hmmm....
5) If the Butcher is still unappealing to you, Bone Shredder is another option. Though it's more expensive than Butcher (it has echo), it comes down a turn earlier and is less black-intensive. It's much weaker though (a 1/1).
6) Or you can have 2 of each. Play shredder, then target it with the Butcher. When the butcher dies your opponent loses another creatue.
I"m convinced... Butcher's back... but I guess using it on my own Bone Shredder/ Nekrataal is somewhat more effective than using it on my opponent, unless they have something REALLY big and ugly.
7) Duress is a very good card, but it cannot discard creatures.
But it CAN let you know what your opponent has, and whether you can handle it.
8) Cabal Therapy is reuseable and more flexible than Ostracize. If your opponent has a Wrath of God but no fatties, you can Therapy that and then drop the Wumpus.
Maybe 2x Duress and 2x Cabal Therapy... peek at their hand with Duress, toss something dangerous, then follow up with Cabal to toss some more?
[/B]

Two additional questions: First, how is this thing supposed to deal with Arkoma? Once she comes down it's pretty much game, itn't it? And second, is Dark Ritual worthwhile, or will I have enough mana as it is?

[Razola]

Akroma can be dealt with via Innocent Blood, but you'll probably have to build a solid side board. Just don't forget that you could attack with the Wumpus and when she blocks it use Predator's Strike.

But the best option is to side in Chainer's Edict, Diabolic Edict, Barter in Blood, etc.

[Red Angel]

Originally posted by Raz
But the best option is to side in Chainer's Edict, Diabolic Edict, Barter in Blood, etc.

Yeah... the only real way to kill Arkoma with this deck is to run into it... since if you play any of the above, you better hope they have just Arkoma (or Arkoma and something else in the case of Barter in Blood) in play.

Just a thought, but, speaking of lands, how would Tainted Wood work?

Tap: Add one colorless mana to your mana pool.
Tap: Add B or G to your mana pool. Play this ability only if you control a swamp.

It's only uncommon, and I could cut 4 Forests for it... whaddya think?