NEW!!! The Legend of Zelda, reborn: Mature!!!

[Saturos]

http://cube.ign.com/articles/513/513375p1.html

http://media.cube.ign.com/media/572/572738/vids_1.html

http://media.cube.ign.com/media/572/572738/imgs_1.html

The wait is WAY is almost over!!! Nintendo is releasing a NEW MATURE The Legend of Zelda for the GCN!! Highly detailed, dark and cutting edge graphics you've never expected on the GCN!!! Witness as Link takes on this journey as an adult! Even Link himself got a new make-over from the SCII game!!!

Okay, I'm settled down now.

ENJOY!!!!

[Heald]

...then after your expectations are appropriately built up, they go 'Hah! Just kidding! You're getting the sh*tty graphic version!'.

Just like at Spaceworld.

[PNT510]

I just watched the video, it took like 50 hours to load. It looks very nice, I would still rather have another wind waker.

[Powarun]

ITs looks awsome, can't wait, I am offically excited, dang I think E3 was ruled by Nintendo this year.

[classy_cat18]

Bad news: No Wind Waker. I got too attached to the cel shading.

Good news: *glomps new Link* He's so cute!

[Yoh Asakura]

Wind Waker sucked, in every way possible. Story, Graphics, Gameplay, Music, everything.

This does indeed look really ****ing cool.

[PNT510]

I don't think wind waker sucked, the only thing I didn't like was collecting all the charts for the triforce shards, and the bosses were to simple. How does the gameplay suck? It was the same as the N64 gameplay.

[Damian Silverblade]

Of course, I've long been of the opinion that Zelda hasn't had a truly GOOD game since Link to the Past (yes, I know, many criticis and fans disagree with me there.). I played through Ocarina, then didn't even bother with the further two manifestations - they just felt too kidified for me.

[phaedrus]

Who else is buying this premier day?

Also, Wind Waker did not suck. You're just psycho. The prejudice about it is "omg link looks so gay." It was probably Gamecube's best game of the year, IMHO.

[Razola]

Looks very good, but I wanted another Wind Waker.

[RedStarWarrior]

I, too, anticipated another WW. However, who knows what Nintendo has in store for E3 2005? Perhaps WW2 will be premiered then.

[Razola]

...then after your expectations are appropriately built up, they go 'Hah! Just kidding! You're getting the sh*tty graphic version!'.

Just like at Spaceworld.
I wouldn't mind. Of course, I'm not shallow either.

And Yami Yugi or Yoh Shimbo Jones (whatever crappy name you've chosen), how exactly is Wind Waker's story any different from the previous Zeldas? Ganon gets Zelda, Link must rescue her. Or maybe the story DOESN'T suck, and you need to hop off a certain bandwagon that died a year ago.

[SWAMPERT1]

Is it just me or does it look like Epona seems to be a BIG part of this story? BTW it looks great.

[Powarun]

WInd waker was fun with its graphics and all, but it fit teh sea better, the contrast between land and sea is there, where this new Zelda game seems to be on land, where water can be easily detailed. plus a lot of fans were angered at Cel shading.

[PNT510]

Is it just me or does it look like Epona seems to be a BIG part of this story? BTW it looks great.
Who said it was Epona?

[RedStarWarrior]

BTW, since I forgot to say it earlier, YAMI, stfu. Cel shading in WW owned!

[Saturos]

Do you even know WHY Nintendo decided to go with a cel-shaded version of Link? It brought about new emotions that gave life to the character. Link's eyes would move and lock onto a certain object, making it look like he has interest in it.

Link would sidle across a wall, and peek around the corner. I have never seen any other game that mainly focuses on emotions of their characters before.

I, myself, love the way they made the game. It gave it an anime type feel. I totally felt if I was in Link's shoes, seeing what he was witnessing throughout his journey.

[RedStarWarrior]

Well, celebrate, Saturos, because apparently they do still have a cel-shaded sequel in the works. We might get a preview of it at E3 next year.

[Damian Silverblade]

Meh.

I didn't like any of the post SNES game because they were too kidified. IE, compare LTTP where you were declared an outlaw and had the soldiers of Hyrule trying to capture you all over the place with OoT where the only dangers outside dungeon were wolves/undeads which both could be avoided through the simple expedient of either A)Using your horse or B)Knowing the sun song.

How are we supposed to feel that we're battling against the great evil if said great evil can't even be bothered to actually take action against the guy who's beating all of his temples guardians and minions until the very end of the game? (Ocarina). It's just plain ridiculous.

As for cel-shading, I didn't like it. Yeah, Link could be seen "looking at something" more clearly. But frankly, considering that said something looked ten shades of crappy due to cel-shading to begin with, the only result IMHO was to make me pity him for having to look at it to begin with.

[Razola]

Damian, Zelda is rooted in video game tradition. That is, the Arch-Villain is incredibly lazy, using all his resources to avoid fighting you.

Or we can come up with some excuse that Ganon is busy looking for the Triforce or whatever. Does it really matter? Kill the monsters already.

[Kari and Mewtwo]

And I thought the Ocarina of Time version of Link was kickass..

The new Link OWNS!! The addition of Chainmail under his tunic is so ****ing awesome. Not so much different than the OoT Link, but MUCH more detail than that N64 polygon-rendered version of Mr. Badass Hylian. Something tells me this is gonna surpass even Ocarina of Time.

[Damian Silverblade]

Damian, Zelda is rooted in video game tradition. That is, the Arch-Villain is incredibly lazy, using all his resources to avoid fighting you.

Or we can come up with some excuse that Ganon is busy looking for the Triforce or whatever. Does it really matter? Kill the monsters already.

My point being that in LTTP (for comparison) there *were* plenty of evil minions out hunting you. The fact that the archvilain didn't come personally I don't mind ; the fact that he sent virtually no one against you on the other hand is just plain ludicrous and really took away from the game.

I don't like walking through Hyrule field on a sunny day...and walking...and walking...and walking... and still nothing happening because it's not night or because I have Epona.

[The Muffin Man]

My point being that in LTTP (for comparison) there *were* plenty of evil minions out hunting you. The fact that the archvilain didn't come personally I don't mind ; the fact that he sent virtually no one against you on the other hand is just plain ludicrous and really took away from the game.

I don't like walking through Hyrule field on a sunny day...and walking...and walking...and walking... and still nothing happening because it's not night or because I have Epona.


The whole point is that Hyrule Fields not important. There's really no reason to send minions into Hyrule field. That's less minions to fortify the Shadow temple.

[Mikey]

I actually prefer what they have done now. WW was an awesome game, but I still wanted to see what a more realistic approach to Zelda on the gamecube would be like. It's a way to balance each person's preference and a good idea in my opinion. They can return to cel shading once this is complete, but for now I await this game. It looks very cool and obviously will be the best game of 2005 provided Conker Live and Uncut isn't pushed to that year. :)

[PNT510]

Meh.

I didn't like any of the post SNES game because they were too kidified. IE, compare LTTP where you were declared an outlaw and had the soldiers of Hyrule trying to capture you all over the place with OoT where the only dangers outside dungeon were wolves/undeads which both could be avoided through the simple expedient of either A)Using your horse or B)Knowing the sun song.

How are we supposed to feel that we're battling against the great evil if said great evil can't even be bothered to actually take action against the guy who's beating all of his temples guardians and minions until the very end of the game? (Ocarina). It's just plain ridiculous.

As for cel-shading, I didn't like it. Yeah, Link could be seen "looking at something" more clearly. But frankly, considering that said something looked ten shades of crappy due to cel-shading to begin with, the only result IMHO was to make me pity him for having to look at it to begin with.
Did you have the running shoes in LTTP? You could run away for more or less every enemy in the game with those.

[Damian Silverblade]

Yeah, but at least the enemies were there.

With OoT, the enemies didn't even bother to show up except a handful at night if you didn't have the horse.

TMM - Hyrule field unimportant or not, Ganon would probably have some minions out hunting Link (especially once Link starts taking out the temples), and it's not unreasonable to assume that they would even try to attack him while he's traveling in Hyrule Field.

The empty Hyrule field made for a weak central area. There's a reason I almost never stepped in there unless I had to once I learned the various teleport songs, and it's boredom. Hyrule Field is atrociously lacking in interesting stuff, the only reason why you'd ever want to go there is because the game forces you to in order to get where you want to go.

That's another thing of note - in LTTP and such, "hyrule field" (so to speak) was full of obstacles and you often had to try to find a road to this or that location - often without much success. In OoT Hyrule Field is one vast expense of boring grass. No cliff, no mountain, no trees and forests (well, not much) to it - just grass.

[kurai]

They seem to have appeased both sides, at least partly:

May 12, 2004 - IGNcube on Tuesday uncovered new details about Nintendo's upcoming action-adventure Legend of Zelda for GameCube. A couple of important questions about the game have now been answered.

Leading up to the pre-E3 2004 show, gamers believed that Nintendo was working on a sequel to Legend of Zelda: Wind Waker, which would in turn indicate that the action-adventure would be cel-shaded in nature and would also likely feature a young version of hero Link. But as the newly redesigned Legend of Zelda proves, the company has instead reverted to a presentation more akin to the dark and gritty look of Link and Gannondorf previewed at Space World 2000 in Japan.

Nintendo however confirmed to IGNcube that the newly redesigned title does in fact run on a modified version of the Wind Waker engine. The company also revealed that the new Legend of Zelda is in fact not a remake of any kind, but instead an entirely original undertaking.

Meanwhile, more gameplay details were divulged. Link will feature the same eye-tracking system used in Wind Waker. He'll be able to knock all types of enemies off their horses and send them crashing to the ground. And a new dynamic camera system will shoot some dungeons from new perspectives. Evidently when Link explores some still-unrevealed dungeons the camera will pan back and shoot the action from a top-down angle. Players will be able to see parts of the 3D maze that lies in wait. But when the character encounters an enemy the camera will seamlessly sweep in again to shoot the battle from the normal behind-the-back perspective.

Neither Shigeru Miyamoto nor Eiji Aonuma will be directing the Legend of Zelda title. Both serve as producers. A new, still-secret director will helm the project.

A new, longer Legend of Zelda video that shows off never-before-seen areas and scenarios will be previewed behind closed doors at E3. IGNcube will have eyes on impressions for readers shortly after we see it.

:love2:

[phaedrus]

i :love2: it too.

hm.....after watching this, i don't see Link with the Master Sword alot. Which means one of two things.....

Halfway through the game, you "pick up" the Master Sword

OR

You get the Master Sword 1/3 of the way through the game, and you have to "revive" the Master Sword (As in Wind Waker)

Wind Waker, was in my opinion, the best Gamecube game of '03.

Also, if you argue against anything Zelda, you're gonna get massacred by Zelda fans. Just a thing to remember.

we need to make a HARDCORE ZELDA FAN CLUB in pcg.... >:o

[The Muffin Man]

Yeah, but at least the enemies were there.

With OoT, the enemies didn't even bother to show up except a handful at night if you didn't have the horse.

TMM - Hyrule field unimportant or not, Ganon would probably have some minions out hunting Link (especially once Link starts taking out the temples), and it's not unreasonable to assume that they would even try to attack him while he's traveling in Hyrule Field.


First of all, the Stal Children were not Ganondorfs minions.
Secondly, Ocarina is chronologically the FIRST Legend of Zelda. Ganon didn't know "Oh crap, this kids gonna be a thorn in my side for generations to come." So he really had no idea Link would even get past his first few guardians.

[Tainted]

they just felt too kidified for me.

Since we are all insecure about feeling like a child, and we all know playing a game with characters that look childish makes us women. Hey-- let's all boot up a good game of "holy crap-- look at the graphics. This cinematic is awesome-- wait, do I get to play this god damn movie?"

I liked Wind Waker. If you didn't like it, you're wrong. End of story. I do, however, want to see what the Gamecube can do with more "realistic" looking graphics. It should be quite a show. Cel-shaded or not, I'll still buy it.

Adieu,
Zak Hunter

[Gengachu]

Since we are all insecure about feeling like a child, and we all know playing a game with characters that look childish makes us women. Hey-- let's all boot up a good game of "holy crap-- look at the graphics. This cinematic is awesome-- wait, do I get to play this god damn movie?"

I liked Wind Waker. If you didn't like it, you're wrong. End of story. I do, however, want to see what the Gamecube can do with more "realistic" looking graphics. It should be quite a show. Cel-shaded or not, I'll still buy it.

Adieu,
Zak Hunter

I wouldn't necessarily say that if he didn't like it, he's wrong. One of my friends didn't like it much because he thought it was too easy and short. However, if you don't like the game because of the graphics then your a dumbass. The graphics aren't important. I don't really care about the graphics of the new game, although they are very good. I just hope the gameplay is as good as previous Zelda games.

[Scythemantis]

Quite frankly, I do not like the "serious"-feeling zelda games at all. I just could not get into Ocarina or MM...they felt like they were trying too hard to appeal to the final fantasy/anime fangirl crowd.

I was overjoyed when they scrapped another boring, melodramatic title for something *fun* and *original*-looking like Wind Waker. I was hoping they'de keep the cartoonish look, if only spite all the people who complained about it online. Nuts to them.

When I was younger, Link was a goofy little elf. He was the fantasy equivalent of mario. In my mind he is NOT supposed to look mature. :P

[Tainted]

I wouldn't necessarily say that if he didn't like it, he's wrong. One of my friends didn't like it much because he thought it was too easy and short. However, if you don't like the game because of the graphics then your a dumbass. The graphics aren't important. I don't really care about the graphics of the new game, although they are very good. I just hope the gameplay is as good as previous Zelda games.

Of course he is. I'm god. No one can have an opinion against god...

It's called me being arrogant, it was meant as an option of humor to my post-- if you believe otherwise then you're wrong. See, I did it again. It's sarcasm, the best form of humor.

Adieu,
Zak Hunter

[Saturos]

Heheheh...

You don't have to worry about yourself sounding so macho and all-grown up. Life treats us as it is. You have to go with the flow of what it brings.

Meaning: We don't have any control on what Nintendo makes. It's our job as to say what our ideas are and how to explain it to them. I didn't like it that much that Wind Waker was made like a cartoon. They chose it that way because it was THE best way to make it as Link's perspective as a child.

Remember Pokemon the Movie 2000? Ash had the whole world on his shoulders. He had to complete the task or the world would be destroyed. Same thing with Link. Nintendo wanted to show Link as a child because it takes a lot of COURAGE and determination to set things right. Especially if it were to happen to a young child.

If that happened to my sister, we'd all be screwed (Yes, my sister's smart, but acts like a total dumbass.).

Plus, when Nintendo had made Wind Waker as a cel-shaded game, they could cram more information into the game, and make it sound longer and exciting. I, myself, love artwork. The game was beautifully made, animation was superb. Also for making the game cel-shaded, they can focus more on emotions and movement of objects and characters.

Next school year for me, I'm going to North Carolina School of the Arts. I want to do artwork on the computer and stuff. Then, I want to marry my girlfriend, and move all the way to Redmond, WA, so I can work... Where? Nintendo of America!

You don't realize how much money a video game designer makes a year, do you? $200-$400,000 a year!

I think I said enough. I'm done.

[Misdreavus]

Ok... I'm totally lost here. I just found out about this when I got my info for it from Nintendo a few days ago. What exactly is this game? From the Nintendo ad, it seemed nothing more than a version of the Four Swords GBA game for Gamecube, which would be a big disappointment. I've looked through the posts but I still can't understand what this game is. Are the graphics like WW or like OoT/MM? Is there a single player quest? Is the multiplayer anything more than Four Swords for GBA on the GC? Thanks.

BTW, where is the picture of Link that people are talking about?

[classy_cat18]

Ok... I'm totally lost here. I just found out about this when I got my info for it from Nintendo a few days ago. What exactly is this game? From the Nintendo ad, it seemed nothing more than a version of the Four Swords GBA game for Gamecube, which would be a big disappointment. I've looked through the posts but I still can't understand what this game is. Are the graphics like WW or like OoT/MM? Is there a single player quest? Is the multiplayer anything more than Four Swords for GBA on the GC? Thanks.

BTW, where is the picture of Link that people are talking about?

You're talking about two different Zelda games. There is a Gamecube version of the Four Swords coming out very soon. But we're talking about the sequel to TWW, and it looks like OoT Gamecube style. No multiplayer as far as I know. For the picture of Link, you can look for it on ign.com or something like that.

[Strider]

Looking from the screen shots (haven't seen the trailer yet for some reason), this game looks promising. Although I did like the graphics of Wind Waker, I was also hoping to see the return of the Ocarina/Majora type graphics.

But yeah, the game is looking very nice... I definately look forward to playing this installment.

[Sarcastic Assassin]

I liked Wind Waker. If you didn't like it, you're wrong. End of story. I do, however, want to see what the Gamecube can do with more "realistic" looking graphics. It should be quite a show. Cel-shaded or not, I'll still buy it.

Is Soul Calibur II not realistic enough for you?

I was instantly won over by this new LoZ. It only took the first few seconds to let me know that the GCN could easily match the PS2 or XBox in terms of graphical quality, any day of the week. Plus, the brief combat scenes that were showed (at least in the GameSpot preview) looked orgasmic.

[Dean]

Is Soul Calibur II not realistic enough for you?

I was instantly won over by this new LoZ. It only took the first few seconds to let me know that the GCN could easily match the PS2 or XBox in terms of graphical quality, any day of the week. Plus, the brief combat scenes that were showed (at least in the GameSpot preview) looked orgasmic.

coughfanboycough

Anyways this new Zelda game does look pretty good.. never played Wind Waker, never owned a GameCube, and its still not enough to make me get one... its disappointing that GC doesnt have more to offer, because there are several really great games... unfourtunately everything inbetween is utter crap...

[Gengachu]

It only took the first few seconds to let me know that the GCN could easily match the PS2 or XBox in terms of graphical quality, any day of the week.

I take it you haven't played Resident Evil, Resident Evil 0, or Metroid Prime. Gamecube has the best possible graphics, it's just harder to program for, so games that are multi-console look better on X-Box. I don't know why you would think the PS2 has better graphics than the Gamecube. That never should've been questioned. PS2 sucks.

[Saturos]

True, but Sony and Microsoft have FILM quality graphics. Sony has very good cinema scenes, mainly from their movies they've had like Spider-man and such.

The XBOX hardware is mainly running off of the NVIDIA graphics card. What do expect Microsoft to do there? They've stripped apart a computer and put it in game-format. There system is good, but they have NEVER put time into creating it to have unique qualities and such.

GCN has all of that. The main processor of the GCN has more elements to create on the screen (fog, lighting, etc.) and can surpass anything that XBOX would throw at them. What about Sony? Did you not forget that when Nintendo wanted to make a system (which led to the N64) that utilizes CDs for the games, that they called upon the help of Sony to do that?

Sony took Nintendo's ideas and came out with the PlayStation. And the N64 still kicks the PSOnes butt graphic-wise.

The GCN will live on far enough, even if Nintendo makes another next-gen console, they still won't quit making the GCN, because NO othere developer has ever pumped out the the GCN's full capabilities at all!!

[Crazy]

NO WHY ARE THEY SCREWING WITH THE LoZ series?! It isn't meant to be a mature series. Darn jackasses who complained about it being "kitty" have probably destroyed the whole thing. Crap,crap,crap,crap.

[mew151]

Crazy, even if you think they "de-kiddy-fied" it, it doesnt give any excuse to judge it by its graphics. Itll still be a great game, but with a different graphical style.

[The Muffin Man]

NO WHY ARE THEY SCREWING WITH THE LoZ series?! It isn't meant to be a mature series. Darn jackasses who complained about it being "kitty" have probably destroyed the whole thing. Crap,crap,crap,crap.
Yeah, damn Ocarina of Time for starting this trend!


...

[The Muffin Man]

True, but Sony and Microsoft have FILM quality graphics. Sony has very good cinema scenes, mainly from their movies they've had like Spider-man and such.

Ermm...Sonys actually weakest graphically. They push their system to the edge, yes, but Microsoft and Nintendos "Edge" is farther out.


The XBOX hardware is mainly running off of the NVIDIA graphics card. What do expect Microsoft to do there? They've stripped apart a computer and put it in game-format. There system is good, but they have NEVER put time into creating it to have unique qualities and such.

GCN has all of that. The main processor of the GCN has more elements to create on the screen (fog, lighting, etc.) and can surpass anything that XBOX would throw at them. What about Sony? Did you not forget that when Nintendo wanted to make a system (which led to the N64) that utilizes CDs for the games, that they called upon the help of Sony to do that? This suddenly makes Sony the most powerful? No. It makes them one of the most knowledgable.


Sony took Nintendo's ideas and came out with the PlayStation. And the N64 still kicks the PSOnes butt graphic-wise.
*Rubs temple*God, I'm a self-proclaimed Nintendo fanboy, and even THIS is painful to read for ME...


The GCN will live on far enough, even if Nintendo makes another next-gen console, they still won't quit making the GCN, because NO othere developer has ever pumped out the the GCN's full capabilities at all!!
This is true for XBox and also partly true for PS2.


And for the record, Soul Calibur is one of the best examples of a shitty fighter.

[Dean]

Point #1: You are just being ignorant if you are going to try and say that GameCube has better graphics than Xbox. It's not a matter of opinion, it's a matter of fact, and you're just making a damn fool out of yourself.

Point #2: GameCube is not "harder to program for", get your head out of your ass.

Point #3: Since when does making up stuff that isn't true constitute as a valid argument on these boards. Use some common sense people.

[Crazy]

Yeah, damn Ocarina of Time for starting this trend!


...

Amen(Sarcasm)! No, I mean mature not like OoT. I looked at the pictures and the thread says MATURE so I figured there would be blood and stuff. Even though I didn't notice any,they just need to be careful. Next thing you know they will turn it into a FPS.

[PNT510]

If Zelda becomes an FPS it won't happen before Mario starts stealing cars and killing hookers.

[phaedrus]

If Zelda becomes an FPS it won't happen before Mario starts stealing cars and killing hookers.

watch samus have to go through whore camp and become a prostitute =|

i swear to god when those things happen i will kill myself even if i become a billionaire.

[Razola]

X-Box has the best potential for graphics, followed by the Cube, and then the PS2. Having all that power means nothing if no one is willing to utilize it. Generally 1st-Party titles will get the most mileage since they have the resources and know the system inside and out.


And for the record, Soul Calibur is one of the best examples of a shitty fighter.
Every time I think you have no taste in games, you go a little bit lower.

[The Muffin Man]

X-Box has the best potential for graphics, followed by the Cube, and then the PS2. Having all that power means nothing if no one is willing to utilize it. Generally 1st-Party titles will get the most mileage since they have the resources and know the system inside and out.


Every time I think you have no taste in games, you go a little bit lower.
Because I didn't like how there was little balance in SC?


Kilik - Massive range, decent damage. yeah, THAT'S fair. "Side step!" you say? He can swing it sideways. Any good Kilik player can swing it around before anyone can get in.

Maxi - Need I say more? Besides Kilik, Maxi can pull off huge combos without TRYING.

Link - ...

Nightmare - Huge damage, huge range, and once he gets going he's not all that slow.

Heihachi - "Let's give him no weapon, put his weapon on his elbows, and have him use freakishly long arms instead! Then let's make him imbalanced!"


Now if you'd like to have taste in games yourself, then you can have the right to talk back Raz. Until then, shut the **** up an GET TASTE IN GAMES.


God, not my fault there are people BUYING this crap.

[Razola]

Oh noes! Because TMM feels like he's the lord of SC, I have no taste.

Seriously, the game is fine if you play under house rules for a few characters. Quit yer whining.

EDIT: I'm actually curious what TMM enjoys to play. Bloodrayne? The Sims?

[PNT510]

Hey TMM. Maybe if you weren't a ****tard you'd know you can guard impact to block Kilik's side swing.

The thing that's nice about SC2 is you have to use different stratigies against different characters.

[Drago]

Four pages in, SC argument starts. Better than I expected, really. For that regard, I'll just say imbalance does not a bad fighter make. It's the point where a game is so unimaginative, dismal, and frustrating that you could not care less of any imbalance (which I found did not apply to SC), is an indication of a game being feces-like in quality. That's just my opinion and whether or not its of any relevance, there isn't any hope of someone else's being swayed, thereby rendering it pointless.

Moving along then, a new mature Zelda is one of the smart moves Nintendo made. I loved Wind Waker, and many others did as well, but let's face it. A cel-shaded title in an important franchise merely fuels the dull argument that Nintendo is a kiddie system. We all know that it isn't, and anyone who can't see past that is an absolute tool, but the graphic presentation of a game is oftentimes enough to steer away the (extreme) casual gamer, as well as the lack of Sims in the title.
Innovation is Nintendo's strong suit. However, they don't seem quite as adept at giving people what they want. Harsh words, I realise, and I'm a Nintendo fanboy myself, but it's quite clear. This is evidenced by an insane obsession for connectivity. It should be used as a delightful bonus that sets GameCube apart from other systems, not a basis for a multitude of titles.

Recently, however, Nintendo have made some steps in the right direction. This new Zelda may steer away some who appreciated the cel-shaded appearance, but it will appeal to a far broader, less open-minded audience who thought 'Wind Waker has crap graphics'. The good of the many far outweigh the few, and essentially, even those who know better than to judge a game by its appearance should manage to appreciate the next Zelda for what it should be, a damn fine title (Likelihood is it'll be more than that, but that's an estimated minimum).
Also on the Zelda front, Four Swords + has made great strides as a madcap multiplayer title, and has Tetra's Trackers/Navi Trackers as an addition. That's exactly how it should be made. Not as a game, but as an addition. Now, rather than look at what the game could've been, skeptics will instead be unable to deny the fact that that is a welcome addition.

Here's to a new Zelda game, then.

[Dean]

That's odd TMM, because I found those to be some of the worst characters. Sure, good for a button masher or someone who has no clue what they are doing, but anybody who has half a brain can beat them handily. Says a lot for you.

[Razola]

Also on the Zelda front, Four Swords + has made great strides as a madcap multiplayer title, and has Tetra's Trackers/Navi Trackers as an addition. That's exactly how it should be made. Not as a game, but as an addition.
Here's to a new Zelda game, then.
Tetra's Trackers has been removed from the US version due. The game was not nearly as deep as the other two modes, and it was decided that it was not worth delaying the game to translate the voice bits for the releases outside Japan.

I've also heard the Avdenture Mode in Four Swords takes around 30 hours. Throw in the battle mode and this is more like a full-fledged game than a bargain purchase.

[The Muffin Man]

Oh noes! Because TMM feels like he's the lord of SC, I have no taste.

Seriously, the game is fine if you play under house rules for a few characters. Quit yer whining.

EDIT: I'm actually curious what TMM enjoys to play. Bloodrayne? The Sims?
Yes. I love travesty against gaming...

Current favorites:
Metroid Zero Mission
Lunar(GBA)
Mario and Luigi: SSS
Earthbound
Wind Waker
Super Smash Bros.
KoTOR*Can't remember the last time I played anything else*
LaPucelle Tactics
FFX-2
FFX

Looking into River City Ransom EX and definetly Metal Slug 3.

And Fable but that's never coming out.

And to everyone else - The thing that I DID like was changing your strategy. Only problem is that when everyone uses the SAME STRATEGY it gets to the point where if you don't change, the 1 player sucks, and if you DO change, you get beat by the same damn thing over and over. The most annoying part was my favorite character from the arcade version(Raphael) seems to have gotten nerfed. Although I cannot deny nor confirm what my friend says, he's an ******* who uses only Mitsurugi and claims he's godly anyhow.
Anyway, he claims Raphael has attacks that DO NOTHING whatsoever. Can anyone confirm/deny? I returned the game quite promptly after purchase before I even CARED to play the game anymore. But yes, I did play it(PS2 version, although I had the "honor" of playing the GC version with Link).

[PNT510]

Raphael wasn't nerfed. If you played the game you would know that. He doesn't do lots of damage but he is easy to get long combos with.