Who is NUMBER ONE?

[Metal Claw]

Besides The 3 Regi pokemon, Rayquaza, Latios and Latias...Which pokemon is technically the best in the game(s)?

Please state why you believe so.

I would say one, but I cant pick! I would say a versatile and useful pokemon, but all of the pokemon seem to have a major weakness somewhere......

[rinku]

YOU are number six.

*ahem*

No doubt opinion will differ, but I'd suggest Milotic. No major weaknesses (only vulnerable to Electric & Grass but a base 125 SD does a lot to stop that), great selection of moves and decent special attack value (no pure annoyer/tank this one by any means). It's even mid-range in speed (base 81) so if you want one that is speedy you can manage it (Max possible with +Speed personality at L100 would be 287).

My usual set is:

Ice Beam/Surf (depending on team needs. Surf is usually best)
Confuse Ray
Toxic
Recover

Bloody hard to take down without a OHKO.

[Don't Run With Scizors]

There is no number one Pokemon.

That's why you carry six.

[Music Dragon]

Of course, some Pokemon can get better than others can. But honestly, I don't think there is any best Pokemon. My favorite Pokemon is Altaria, but not in battles. It's because it can sing AND it is a dragon.

[Ultimate Pikachu]

Different Pokémon have diiferent strengths and weaknesses. There is no best, if there was it would be used by everyone. Some are better than others, but they all can be countered by something.

[phaedrus]

i go by the policy of 6=1

so:

alakazam
swampert
raichu
kingdra
slaking
weezing

no single poke is best. sure some are a *bit* broken, but whatever. i like kazam becaue triple punch is awesom

[Kari and Mewtwo]

In terms of Number One poke in base stats, then that would be a tie between Rayquaza, Lugia, Ho-oh, and Mewtwo since they all have a base total of 680, the highest base total in the game.

In turms of Number One poke overall, there is none.

[Iveechan]

He said legendaries not included... Slaking has very high base stats, but truant ability and its special defense are its hinderences.

[Music Dragon]

Well, as I and many others so clearly pointed out to you, there is no best Pokemon. That's what makes me like Pokemon: There are lots of them but as noone is the best, everybody use different styles, strategies and teams. Unlike other games where you're always the same character. That's also ok, but here you are more, well, yourself. You know that nobody is exactly like you in the game. No Pokemon is best!

EDIT: Wow! Altaria is on Iveechan's Ideal Sapphire Team List!

[andyizcool]

In terms of Number One poke in base stats, then that would be a tie between Rayquaza, Lugia, Ho-oh, and Mewtwo since they all have a base total of 680, the highest base total in the game.

In turms of Number One poke overall, there is none.

Remember Kyogre and Mewtwo with Calm Mind can be invincible in the hands of the right Trainer.

[Don't Run With Scizors]

Kyogre and Mewtwo still have way too many weaknesses to be invincible. Sure, there are some tricks that make them harder to take down than others, but there is no way they can properly defend themselves against everything.

[Crazy]

If there are no best pokemon then why are Legendaries banned from tournaments?

[andyizcool]

If there are no best pokemon then why are Legendaries banned from tournaments?

Their Base Stats are just much higher than other Pokemon. Also they can sometimes have wider Movepools to cover all their weaknesses. If Legends were around the n00b kids would just get their Team of Legends and battle. Even though kids have Legends with rubbish IVs their Stats would still be quite powerful.

[Rudoku]

Ok guys, we can let him in on the real "Number One". It's Wobbuffet. And don't you forget it.

[Kari and Mewtwo]

Kyogre- dies to Quagsire & Shedinja easily
Mewtwo- dies to Ninjask? Salacversal heracross?

tell the truth, i dont know what downs mr m00t00. The first person to respond "Blissey" will get shot.

[andyizcool]

Kyogre- dies to Quagsire & Shedinja easily
Mewtwo- dies to Ninjask? Salacversal heracross

All I can say about Kyogre is, how? The new Standard Kyogre if anyone uses a Kyogre has Toxic to handle Shedinja or Quagsire. Mewtwo would lose to Heracross if it somehow was low on HP with Swarm and has a Salac Berry activated making Megahorn own. Blissey owns all Special Sweepers unless they have a physical attack hidden somewhere in their Moveset.

[rinku]

I'll return to my sugestion (which appears to be ignored):

Who owns Milotic?

[Amethyst Flygon]

I'll return to my sugestion (which appears to be ignored):

Who owns Milotic?

I don't own Milotic because I can't find Feebas yet. I know how to find it, just haven't put enough effort in it. I would love to have one sometime in the future.

[HedgeCat]

I don't own Milotic because I can't find Feebas yet. I know how to find it, just haven't put enough effort in it. I would love to have one sometime in the future.

i believe he means who can beat Milotic?

[rinku]

Yes. Sorry for the spurious jargon

Since the *actual* topic of the thread is to suggest non-legends who would be contenders for "best pokémon", I state again (but more clearly):

What pokémon would force you to withdraw Milotic? (I can't think of any myself). Don't feel wedded to my suggested moveset - better ones can be built, I'm sure.

For what its worth, I think the topic is valid - it is a given that no pokémon is *totally* able to deal with *all* opponents. We're discussing which one(s) are the best at dealing with the widest range of opponents. Water pokémon with good special defense are always a good candidate for these as pure water is only vulnerable to Grass & Electric (both Special type attacks). That's the reason why Kyogre is such a fearsome Legend (Shedinja notwithstanding...)

[Rabid_Cow]

What pokémon would force you to withdraw Milotic? (I can't think of any myself).

A couple of pokemon come to mind. Rather situations I should say.

1. I Mind Reader Baton Pass to a pokemon w/Guillotine. My friends ALWAYS switch out their Milotics.

2. Blissey w/Seismic Toss. (No, this doesn't own Mewtwo, Kari, so don't shoot me...)

3. My Modest Milotic. (Surf<>Hidden Power~Grass<>Toxic<>Rest)

4. A pseudohazer w/Roar or Whirlwind. (that WOULD force them to withdraw Milotic)

Now, for the #1 pokemon I'd have to say that there would have to be many territories. But, for the coolest I'd go w/any of these:

Ditto. For God's sake he's a pimp, and he can turn into any pokemon. He isn't exactly the strongest, but hey, he's Ditto.

Sableye. No weakness. That is cool.

Kecleon. A pokemon that can change type without wasting a turn on a Conversion and it's versatile. Nice.

For the strongest, best competitive battlers I'd have to say that b/c Kyogre and Groudon are often competition that Ludicolo or Milotic would be the winner there. Milotic is pretty self explanitory, but Ludicolo is the anti-00ber for those two, plus it can take down Rayquaza w/a couple of Ice Beams. It's Swift Swim will give it the edge on Kyogre and the fact that he has no Special weakness is nice when you set him up against a special sweeper. My Modest Ludicolo w/Giga Drain has shown the true meaning of pain to every Kyogre and Groudon that have hit his path with little trouble. Rayquaza dies unless it has Fly or Aerial Ace.

If it's up to the strongest pokemon it would have to be Milotic or Ludicolo. (That is non-legendary...)

Also, for Kari and Mewtwo I'd just like to say that Endure+Salac+Megahorn on a Heracross is the way to go. Either that or Shuckle. It is a tank.

[Mr.E]

Well, the answer is clearly Mewtwo. The topic, despite what he meant, does not specifically forbid mentioning it. It always has and still is the best. 8)

Anyway, to plug my UU team and to be somewhat on-topic. Eggy is pretty damn sexy.

[Music Dragon]

Well, I don't think Mewtwo is the ultimate Pokemon. I mean even if it can become a real pain when it uses CM a little too much, it's not impossible to defeat it. BTW, Altaria is my favorite pokemon.

[andyizcool]

Well, I don't think Mewtwo is the ultimate Pokemon. I mean even if it can become a real pain when it uses CM a little too much, it's not impossible to defeat it. BTW, Altaria is my favorite pokemon.

You all see to be forgetting Mewtwo can Calm Mind and have good Special Defence. But look at his Ghost and Bug weaknesses which are both Physical. Next look at Kyogre, all weaknesses are Special so Calm Mind could make him invincible only if he has the right timing and stuff to set up a few Calm Minds.

[Ultimate Pikachu]

A Pokémon with high Attack and Baton Passed Attack could OHKO Milotic. Or something with obscenely high Special Attack and Baton Passed Special Attack might OHKO Milotic. Acually, many things could own Milotic.

[Mr.E]

Well, I don't think Mewtwo is the ultimate Pokemon. I mean even if it can become a real pain when it uses CM a little too much, it's not impossible to defeat it.

Any pokemon can be beaten given the right circumstance, so using that as some point against Mewtwo isn't really valid. X(

You all see to be forgetting Mewtwo can Calm Mind and have good Special Defence. But look at his Ghost and Bug weaknesses which are both Physical. Next look at Kyogre, all weaknesses are Special so Calm Mind could make him invincible only if he has the right timing and stuff to set up a few Calm Minds.

Disincluding stat boosts/Choice Band/CHs, nobody can OHKO Mewtwo with Shadow Ball and only Heracross can do it with Bug-Type, who gets smote by Psychic. Oh, sure, there's Endure, but that's not necessarily going to work. You can't switch Heracross in easily and you've got a 50/50 shot if they predict it. Due to its huge versatility, it could also do something like Substitute at that time and screw you completely or T-Tar could accompany the Mewtwo for such purposes. Okay, so the Endure/Salac thing would probably work most of the time given how most people, if they used a Mewtwo, would set up their EVs, but it's more than possible to counter it if one tried.

Kyogre, regardless of how "invincible" it can get, simply isn't as powerful because it has DEFINITE counters. Just about no matter what you do, Ludicolo is going to stall it to death with Leech Seed, Toxic, Protect/Rest, and possibly Rain Dish or Giga Drain too. With its 4x Water resist and ample SpD to handle Ice Beam/Thunder, the massive recovery it gains between attacks is more than enough to, if not kill Kyogre eventually, stall it to death or force a switch-out. Kyogre can't punch through with enough Calm Minds because it just doesn't have time to set them up between Toxic and Leech Seed damage; it'll be forced to Rest before it can do significant damage, which provides enough time for Ludi to recover off whatever wounds it does have or to switch in something that'll force Kyogre out. Lanturn, provided it comes in before Kyogre has its fill of Calm Minds, can do significant damage and laughs at its unboosted attacks. It's another guaranteed Resting, in which case Kyogre is swept back out once again. Raikou has the ability to Calm Mind alongside Kyogre and smite it with type advantage; unless it dies to some unexpected critical before it gets off a Thunderbolt, it kills Kyogre or allows easy pickings for whatever comes out after. Regice or Blissey have more than enough special resistance to stall for Toxic damage until its forced to Rest, in which time the same thing will happen to Kyogre has does anything boosted that takes the time to Rest. No matter what you put on Kyogre, it cannot effectively counter any of these pokemon (and possibly a few more), which is a huge hit to its power. What good is Kyogre as a huge special sweeper if it's rendered helpless against these pokemon, many of them quite popular? There's a difference between being stopped by a few UU and being stopped by 4-5 pokemon so common you're bound to see at least one on 90% of all teams. Shedinja is also an unpleasant surprise. Though you could pull a Heracross-countering Mewtwo and pack T-Tar on your team for purpose, 'tis a much bigger waste since Shedinja is pretty uncommon compared to 'Cross, and your opponent is still forcing at least one switch. You could pack something retarded like AP or HP-whatever too, but then you really limit your choices on special attacks. That's not good when you're probably already choosing between Ice Beam and Thunder.

Mewtwo has a counter. EVERY Mewtwo has a counter. But, with his huge arsenal of possible attacks, you don't KNOW what it will do. You can't prepare for Mewtwo, because it could have something completely different you weren't expecting. It can Calm Mind, but what attacks do you prepare for? Oh well Psychic is more than likely there so you know you want to resist that, but Mewtwo has all sorts of other attacks to worry about as well. How about Registeel? Well if Mewtwo is packing Flamethrower, that's not going to work very well. Starmie? Oops, T-bolt. Eggy? Ice Beam gives you no time to Sleep Powder/Stun Spore or Explode.

Well... what about 'Zam? Luckily, Mewtwo has rather above average Attack stat as well. Bam, Shadow Ball to the face, good game 'Zam. What about T-Tar, Regice, or Blissey? Mewtwo's above-average Attack looms again as Mewtwo crushes them with Focus Punch. (Okay, it'll have to PREDICT T-Tar to Focus Punch it, but Mewtwo could use Brick Break instead if you're worried about that or don't think your Special attacks have the punch against T-Tar.) Hell, if you want to surprise the crap out of people you could even use Bulk Up and probably be fairly successful. Even if you use a -SpA personality and no EVs, Mewtwo has over a 300 Special Attack. It can use that to stave off physical-resistant pokemon like Skarmory. Mewtwo is also tied at the third-fastest in the game.

Regardless of physical or special, there's no "almost" with Mewtwo because you can't bring out a Dugtrio or Raikou to finish off the severely weakened Mewtwo like you could against Kyogre; it's going to go out with a very damaging bang or be able to Recover. Speaking of which, Recover is another advantage Mewtwo has over Kyogre. Mewtwo's Speed already grants it a large advantage; it doesn't have to use Recover at all, because it's so fast that it doesn't need to keep itself at high HP to stave off the attack the opponent's next pokemon will send out. Only Electrode, Ninjask, or the occasional Arcanine/Quick Attacker can do that (and even then, Ninjask is the only worry unless you're dangerously hurt). If you go ahead and use Recover, the one-turn recovery is much more efficient than Rest because it allows you to go on the offensive again the next turn, or whenever you're finished Recovering. Kyogre using Rest gives the opponent enough time to switch, then force switching through Roar/Whirlwind/Encore/whatever. Mewtwo's Recover doesn't have that problem.

Despite the fact pretty much nobody would use it for such a purpose, Mewtwo can also be a heavy team supporter. He can cover the weaknesses of your team very easily. If you team lacks ample defense against attacks, it can Reflect or Light Screen to cover you for a few turns (and Safeguard if anyone cares). If you're having a tough time against a certain attacker or two, Mewtwo can best either. It can Bulk Up itself, or Barrier to gain the upper hand on physical pokemon and then stall them or force Resting with its high special power, giving you time to switch in a pseudo/Hazer and get them out of there. Or it can get a free kill with Counter even, if you're crafty enough; not as if they're going to EXPECT it. Through Calm Mind it can best virtually any special attacker. Why? Even if they have the move too, Mewtwo's Special Attack will always be superior, and his combination of HP and SpD provide at least an equal special resistance as any other Calm Minder. Thanks to Recover, he can even switch in as they start to Calm Mind and eventually come out on top. If you're annoyed by certain specialties, such as Baton Pass (Sub-passing Vap, Mean Look-passing Umby, various stat boosting passer) or Perish Singers (Gengar, Missy, Jynx), you can have Mewtwo use Taunt and stop them dead in their tracks.

Mewtwo does it all. THAT is what makes it superior to a similar special powerhouse like Kyogre. No matter what you put on it (Kyogre), it can be countered with specific other pokemon. Any given Mewtwo probably has at least as many counters as Kyogre, if not more. The difference is that you can't prepare to counter Mewtwo like you could Kyogre, because Mewtwo has no specific moveset assigned to it. If it DOESN'T do what you expected, you're just as screwed as you would be against that Kyogre without an sufficient counter. What about Kyogre? Well, it'll always have its counters. Oh wow, you're choosing two out of the three: Ice Beam, Thunder, and Rest. Without Rest, you're going to die much quicker than you want to against lots of faster pokemon. Without either elemental, you're screwing yourself out of being able to kill virtually any Water-Type or any Grasser. Or you could simply do without Calm Mind, but then you have the very prominent Electric weakness to deal with. Unlike Mewtwo, whose decisions on moveset completely alter which pokemon can and can't counter it, deciding for Kyogre just adds one of two large sets of counter-pokemon alongside the base list that counter Kyogre either way. Regardless of moveset though, the sheer Speed of Mewtwo cannot be denied, and the quickness at which Recover allows it to get back to pounding on stuff is a huge advantage over Kyogre.

How you like 'dem apples? ;/

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As for the Milotic remark above; why thank you Captain Obvious. "Oh, well, if I pit Milotic in a 1-on-1 situation against another pokemon, but I give free stat boosts to this other pokemon, the other pokemon will win!" Would you like to provide us with more observations? Milotic isn't even 2HKOed by non-CB Heracross (no Swarm) with at least some Defense. Heck, I had it take a shot from a Swarmed, CBed Megahorn and it still survived to kill it off with Surf. And it has such high Special Defense that even a Modest Zapdos can't 2HKO, or be lucky to be able to, so long as you dumped even just a bit into SpD (simply Calm personality and a few EVs will work), plus they might hesitate in fear of being crushed by ensuing Mirror Coat. It can effectively stall for Toxic against Calm Minders, at the least enough to minimize the damage the rest of your team takes if it goes down while stalling and at best winning the fight against it. Milotic is just plain tough to kill, and it's not even a complete slouch offensively like Blissey is.