Quote Originally Posted by Checkmate
First off, your thing with apes was countered about ten pages ago. Just because animals do it, doesn't make it right. We are not animals. We have a conscience to tell us right and wrong. That conscience is something that is frequently manipulated and corrupted when a person commits an act so many times that it fails to be wrong or if a person justifies what they think is wrong. Animals do not have a conscience. They are guided by instinct alone. Animals can love, but they love by instinct. Either for mating purposes or they are symbiotic like a pet's love for its owner.
I'm sorry for stepping into this part of a conversation but I have the need to correct things IMO.

We are animals. We are living breathing animals with a more developed brain. We have instincts, we have reflexes. We may not consider ourselves animals but everyone goes back to instinct when in danger. Lord of the Flies (I have not read it but have gotten many reviews from fellow people on this aspect of the book) explains in a surprising way what would happen when humans are separated from their civilization.

Animals have a conscience. It might not look like it, but they do. Octopuses can solve problems and have been proven to be almost as intelligent as us, opening jars and opening locks. An octupus at SeaWorld San Antonio learned how to escape from her enclosure, fall onto the floor, crawl across the floor, climb up a wall, break into a fish enclosure, eat the fish, and crawl back into its aquarium. It took about six days before the workers there knew what was going on (after all, a whole 4 gallon aquarium is missing fish). If that isn't intelligent for a less evolved species then I don't know what is...

Animals can tell right from wrong. They learn, like we do, what is right from wrong. That is how we know what's right from wrong, by learning. Rats have been trained to go through parts that don't cause them pain. Birds learn from other birds which insects are good to eat and which ones make them sick or kill. Dogs are being taught not to approach a rattlesnake from using a "dried" rattlesnake strike at them (this does not hurt the animal, scares it so that it will not get near a rattlesnake who has venom). Heck, snakes have learned to look like poisonous snakes so animals will leave them alone. I doubt a puma will go after a porcupine again after getting a face full of quills.

And yes, that was me who said that, Checkmate.