Super Smash Bros. Brawl (spoilers inside!)

[AdventureSerum]

The Twilight Princess-style Zelda characters are nice, and I'm glad they lightened Link's hair shade from what it was in TP. Does anyone know if Zelda will still transform into Sheik? Because, you know, if she doesn't then I'll have to find a new favorite character.

[Jeff]

From what I've been seeing so far, I seriously doubt any of the old characters will be changing any of their attacks, and it makes sense considering none of the old attacks were dropped in melee. I think now that once Zelda's special attacks are posted, including her Sheik transformation, we'll get Sheik's profile the next day, just like we got Zero Suit Samus's today.

[AdventureSerum]

Ah, good times! Of course, with all these new characters, I might just find somebody new anyway! Of course, not that it matters, seeing as I probably won't have a Wii for a long time yet. Heck, I'm only just getting Melee this upcoming week.

[Starry Might]

If they are really rare, though--even if they're not--what if you like Zero Suit better than normal Samus? It's not like Sheik and Zelda where you can just switch whenever; you're forced to wait for the Smash Ball to use the character you're more comfortable with. Not that big a deal, depending on your playing style, but still kinda sucks.

Yeah, I was thinking something like that after reading Jeff's post...I'd rather be Zero Suit Samus than the regular one (since I think she looks way cooler without that robotic armor on)

HOWEVER, I remember that in "SSBM", you could do a trick where you if picked Zelda and held down a button while the match is loading, she would turn into Sheik the moment the match begins (I think that's how it worked). I hope they put a code like that in "Brawl" that allows you to play as Zero Suit Samus from the beginning of the fight, too.

[Phoenixsong]

liek omg look at today's it's weird

Seriously, though... someone else I know said it might be, like, the beginnings of some sort of storyline or story mode, which would pwn.

Of course, that whole "fighting-trophies-that-know-nothing-but-fighting" deal does the Mexican Hat Dance all over my fanfic plans. Bye-bye, Disney songs. Oh, well, maybe I can just pretend that part doesn't exist.

[Drago]

Smash Bros with a plot... bizarre. I wonder who this new character thingy is, looks kinda like something from Animal Crossing I reckon.
And that's the Halberd, right? Are we to assume that Meta Knight is in cahoots with this character? Perhaps he, Bowser and other bad guys will have some kind of wicked scheme in some kind of story mode.

I would love for Smash Bros to have cut-segments before certain battles in single-player mode. Even if it's simple as the stuff in SCII, it'll make me happy.

[Drago]

Today = Icicle Mountain part 2. I waited all weekend for this?

[Andrew]

Ew, Icicle Mountain is back?


That means the shitty Ice Climbers are too?

Seriously, did anyone EVER willinging and competitively use them. I used them when I wanted my SSBM Retarded friends not to feel absolutely bad when I clobbered them.

[Jeff]

No, it's a DK version of Icicle Mountain, "Rumble Falls". But the "What's at the top" thing is interesting, maybe it stops scrolling after a while.

[Andrew]

The upscroll screen stage was one of my least favourite. Along with Big Blue, Mute City and Rainbow Ride. Pokefloats was okay though.

[Drago]

Yoshi was unveiled today; none too surprising, but I think it's still a pretty sweet update!
His original SSB apperance was based on his Mario 64 model while SSBM was a new model entirely, it seems to me that this is the first time in a Smash he looks more like the Yoshi we're all familiar with.

Note that there's an image of Yoshi letting down his shield, evident in the shell fragments. I don't recall seeing any other shots of the bubble shields so far, is this evidence that they will return, or is only Yoshi priviledged to his own unique one?
Also,

Amongst other things, he can now use his up special move, the Egg Toss, to increase the distance of his jump. That’s enough to earn him a hearty welcome, isn’t it?

That's bound to send obsessive Yoshi fans into a frenzy.

[The Blue Avenger]

That's bound to send obsessive Yoshi fans into a frenzy.

Unless, of course, it means his amazing second jump was nerfed into oblivion.

Also, Andrew, I use the Ice Climbers. They're not bad if you can use them well.

[Phoenixsong]

Ooh, I was right. Yoshi was the next to be revealed. Yay me.

Rumble Falls = HOWEVER! Andrew phails because Mute City, Big Blue and Rainbow Cruise are awesome. How DARE you lump them together with the monstrosity that is Icicle Mountain?! Blasphemy, blasphemy I say!

If they nix Yoshi's second jump, they will have successfully killed the spirit of all that is Yoshi. He's not Yoshi if he can't "fly" like that. I think we're safe in that regard.

Hmm... Bowser and the other badly-type folk being in on the ebil scheme... I don't think that's likely, really. If it is, though, it might mean that there are two versions of aforementioned possible storyline--you can be a good guy and save the world, or you can be a bad guy and (attempt to) conquer it. Kinda like Sonic Adventure 2 or, to an extent, Fable and the like. Ooh, nifty.

As is inevitably the case, I have forgotten what I originally wanted to say. Ah, well. It'll come to me.

[The Blue Avenger]

If they nix Yoshi's second jump, they will have successfully killed the spirit of all that is Yoshi. He's not Yoshi if he can't "fly" like that. I think we're safe in that regard.

Correct me if I'm wrong - I've not played a lot of Yoshi games - but isn't his flutter jump more of a hovering thing rather than the insane amount of air he gets in SSB anyway?

Also, I've been hearing that Rumble Falls differs from Icicle Mountain because it only goes up. I dunno the validity of that, but if it's true, it seems like it'd be more of a vertical Rainbow Cruise. Not that I'd mind either way; I liked Icicle Mountain.

Also, did anyone else notice Mario climbing the ladder in Rumble Falls?

[Phoenixsong]

Admittedly, yes, his jump is exaggerated in SSB, but it can still cover horizontal distance in much the same way as the original. I haven't played too many Yoshi games either, and most were a while ago anyway, but it's possible that he was able to get a bit more air in some games than others. I seem to recall his jumps being at least somewhat impressive in Yoshi's Island and such.

Straight up is bad. That means there's no chance of a freak save should you fall at exactly the same time it begins reversing direction. Of course, that also means no freak saves for the opponent, either, but I never seemed to have a problem with those.

[Chris 2.1]

Knuckle Joe......is he a character or an item? I'm thinking character but I hope not. He looks terrible and a real....well, waste.

[The Blue Avenger]

He's an Assist Trophy.

And don't you dare call him a waste. The Kirby series needs more love.

[Starry Might]

I was gonna say that Knuckle Joe is an Assist Trophy, but Hypotenuse Man beat me to it while I was typing this post! Oh well.

/me decides to comment on other stuff.

Footstool Jump...interesting.

Skyworld = cool (even though we've seen it before in screenshots).

Ha-ha, Yoshi seems really cute this time around.

Rumble Falls looks neat in the second and third screenshots (first one makes it look too generic).

Taking a good look at the "This World..." section...I'd have to agree it's a story mode thing.

So the characters in "Brawl" are just trophies brought to life, huh? That said, it's important to remember that in "SBB" and "SSBM", they showed character trophies coming to life in the intros and stuff, too.

[Chris 2.1]

He seems very much like Kirby in terms of movepool. SSBB needs new original characters like Pit instead. Anyway assist trophy...I assume it's an trophy that attacks the foe? *Needs to read up on it*

Edit: read up on it

[The Blue Avenger]

Yeah, Assist Trophies are like Pokeballs, but with other Nintendo characters. And Knuckle Joe would only be like Kirby in terms of the Vulcan Jab. But I agree there are other characters I'd rather see as playable over Knuckle Joe. King Dedede would round out the Kirby team nicely, and I'd love to see Toad as an addition to the Mario roster. Then maybe some Mother3 or EarthBound characters. P:

[Chris 2.1]

The pitfall item is THE BEST. Loved them in Animal Crossing. A very very very welcome addition.

The items in SSBB are the shnizzle!

[Phoenixsong]

...Okay, sue me. Or whatever. I was wrong. They didn't wait for a few returning members to reveal the next new guy. They didn't even reveal Meta Knight or Snake.

IKE. Yay! IkeikeikeikeikeIKE! My favorite of the FE lords, confirmed to be playable at last. WHOOT Phoenix is a happy girl. I hope Aether's not just a clone of Marth/Roy's blade dance moves, though; those were hard and it made me feel ashamed whenever my little brother managed to pull them off better than me. NO MORE I SAY.

I hope we get an FE stage, too. Dunno what would be best from PoR, though... uh... Greil's fort? Grann Desert? (They've needed a desert stage from the beginning, says I.) Nados Castle? Eh. I dunno. But it sucked that Marth and Roy didn't have home fields, so Ike definitely needs one. "Together We Ride" coming out of Final Destination, Temple and Fountain of Dreams was just odd.

(Random fact: When I was typing my name, I almost spelled it Phoenicis. Which means nothing if you haven't played PoR, but heh. Funny.)

[Chris 2.1]

Seems very cool although I wonder if this limits the chance of Roy/Marth appearing? He seems like a cool character.

[Alucard]

Sick.

Ike is a badass character.

[Shadow Djinn]

...Okay, sue me. Or whatever. I was wrong. They didn't wait for a few returning members to reveal the next new guy. They didn't even reveal Meta Knight or Snake.

IKE. Yay! IkeikeikeikeikeIKE! My favorite of the FE lords, confirmed to be playable at last. WHOOT Phoenix is a happy girl. I hope Aether's not just a clone of Marth/Roy's blade dance moves, though; those were hard and it made me feel ashamed whenever my little brother managed to pull them off better than me. NO MORE I SAY.

I hope we get an FE stage, too. Dunno what would be best from PoR, though... uh... Greil's fort? Grann Desert? (They've needed a desert stage from the beginning, says I.) Nados Castle? Eh. I dunno. But it sucked that Marth and Roy didn't have home fields, so Ike definitely needs one. "Together We Ride" coming out of Final Destination, Temple and Fountain of Dreams was just odd.

(Random fact: When I was typing my name, I almost spelled it Phoenicis. Which means nothing if you haven't played PoR, but heh. Funny.)

In some of the screenshots the characters have been fighting on a castle stage. It's a general theory that this castle is related to FE, possibly Castle Daein or some other significant one, due to the red flag on the stage that has what seems to be the symbol of Daein's army.

[Phoenixsong]

Hm, I've never noticed that. I'll have to go back and check that out, then. *plzplzplzplz*

[Jeff]

Yup looks like it. A generic FE castle to be exact. It's cool that we now get a Fire Emblem stage to go with the character, every game that characters come from should have its own stage. I'm still curious as to if having an Animal Crossing stage and item means we'll get an Animal Crossing character. I guess we'll find out eventually.

[Chris 2.1]

Who would we get? Mr Rosetti? That would be awesome. The castle stage looks good, very interesting. What other new characters do you think we'll get?

[Phoenixsong]

As long as it's not a human, because their design is horrid. As one person once said, "Animal Crossing doesn't have humans. They're pigs."

...Very ugly pigs.

Oh, and instead of a castle, it would have been cool if they'd done a stage like Valorous Roland or Mt. Nereas or whatever it was called, with poison gas coming out of the walls and flames shooting up from the ground. I don't think PoR has a stage like that, but eh. It would have been something different. The stage does still look pretty awesome so far, though. Wonder what's underground? (Maybe THAT's where they're hiding the poison-spewing walls!)

The fact that it's a catch-all castle that could be anything from Daein to Bern to Grado to whatever makes me wonder. Since it doesn't match Ike specifically, does that mean that we'll be getting another FE character from a different game? Does it mean a guaranteed return for Marth or Roy (or both?) Or will it be someone new? Lyn is a pretty popular suggestion, but someone like Hector or Ephraim would be cool for a change in weapon (axes and lances ftw yay). Actually, Eliwood or Eirika wouldn't be terrible, either... or it could be another person from a game that hasn't hit America yet. In which case I'd have no idea who it could be other than Lilina. (Or it could be someone from the upcoming Wii title... ooh.)

Hm. If they had both Eliwood and Roy, that might make for some interesting event matches... father vs. son, anyone?

EDIT: Wasn't in the mood to double post. LOOK AT THE NEW STORY/ADVENTURE MODE LOOK AT IT LOOK AT IT LOOK AT IT

[Chris 2.1]

Erm.

The Subspace Emissary looks EFFING CHALKSOME

Cant wait! Need a Wii first -_-;;

Cut scenes? CHARACTER DEVELOPMENT? SIDE SCROLLING? Whoop


ps: looks like Peach is still in this game.

[Jeff]

For anyone who's been wondering if Sheik (or Gannondorf for that matter) will return, here's an interesting little tidbit I found over at Nintendo World Report.

Ganondorf, Sheik in Smash Bros. Brawl

Aonuma lets it slip that his team has been asked to create character designs for Sakurai.

It turns out the Smash Bros. Dojo isn't the only place where we can find out new details on everyone's most anticipated game. Game Informer Online's (and Nintendo World Report's founder) Billy Berghammer has learned from Zelda series producer Eiji Aonuma that Sheik and Ganondorf will be playable characters in the upcoming Wii all-star fighter, Super Smash Bros. Brawl.

When asked about whether or not Aonuma was consulted on the use of Zelda universe characters in Brawl, he told GI flat-out about the two callbacks from Melee. "Actually, my designers did work on the designs for Sheik and Link and Ganondorf," Aonuma told Berghammer. "So they submitted the initial designs, and so it would fit in the Smash Bros. Brawl environment, they’ve had to tweak some of the designs. But [Masahiro] Sakurai has brought those altered designs to NCL. We’re working very closely with the team of Smash Bros. Brawl to make sure the characters look their best."

This answers the questions of whether or not the two characters would be in the game. There's still the matter of whether or not Zelda and Sheik will still be the same character, however. Will they or won't they?

As for today's update, Ike's special moves are sounding pretty similar to Marth and Roy's.

[Andrew]

Indeed, say goodbye to Marth and Roy

I'm going to miss Counter.

[The Blue Avenger]

As for today's update, Ike's special moves are sounding pretty similar to Marth and Roy's.

You think so? I personally think Ike's up special is more akin to Kirby's (ie, you get blasted up, then you come straight back down), and his neutral special involves summoning an eruption to come up from the ground - neither of those moves remind me of Marth or Roy. I can see the comparisons between Ike's neutral B and Roy's - the whole fire thing - but it really looks to me like it works much differently.

And I really don't think Marth's going anywhere - he's the main character of the first two games, and (if I'm not mistaken - I don't play a lot of Fire Emblem) one of the only characters to be the main character in more than one game. Incidentally, I think Ike is the other one. If they take him out, I will buy a hat and proceed to eat it. :B

[Andrew]

Yes, but remember, those games didn't have a release outside out of Japan. Path of Radience has had a much wider audience and Ike is a much more visable FE character. I didn't know about Marth until SSBM.

Marth is one of my favourite characters, but, it's not looking good for him atm. Two Blue Haired FE swordsmen? (BTW how many fucking swords users are there now?)

Also, Pit's Final Smash looks shit. Or PITiful...

[The Blue Avenger]

Yes, but remember, those games didn't have a release outside out of Japan. Path of Radience has had a much wider audience and Ike is a much more visable FE character. I didn't know about Marth until SSBM.

...which is exactly why Ike is in the game. I still think they'll leave Marth in; he's one of the major characters in the series, he was in the first games, he was in the anime, and by now, everybody knows who he is.

Besides, I wouldn't be surprised if the first few FE games got a translation and were released over the Virtual Console. P:

[Chris 2.1]

They can have Marth and Ike. They had Mario and Dr Mario. They had Kirby and Jigglypuff. Young Link and Link. I wonder if characters like YLink Dr Mario etc will return? I expect Game & Watch will, as well as Falco (maybe more Star Fox characters? Krystal?) and Mewtwo etc.

[Phoenixsong]

Also, note that the castle is a generic FE castle. If Ike were the only FE character in Brawl, they'd have just gone and made it Castle Daein or something specific to PoR. If the castle is a generic one, that means that it can play home to characters from more than one FE title. While that could also mean nixing Marth and Roy in favor of someone else, like Lyn or Hector, it also means that the same stage WILL work for Marth/Roy, which means that at least one of the two might make a comeback.

...Yeah, I said that already, didn't I? Oh, well.

Pit's move = extremely hard to get and overly-dramatic Unown/Beedrill. Looks like it could be a pain in the ass for the other guys sometimes, and useless others. Only time will tell, eh? Palutena looks pretty, though.

Hey, look! There's an Earthbound/Mother item! That particular fact doesn't mean much to me, as I know so little about Earthbound and all that, but it sure looks like fun. That thing basically shuts off half of Samus's moves temporarily. Yay, protection from ranged fighters! (Now, if the Franklin Badge can protect you from the Zero Laser... NOW we're in business.)

[The Blue Avenger]

Hey, look! There's an Earthbound/Mother item!

That update made me very, very happy. Hopefully this signals more Mother things to come.

Interesting fact: the design for the Franklin Badge is based off the real-life Franklin Badge, which was a promotional item for the original Mother - and there were only 200 printed. They rereleased it with the Mother 3 deluxe pack, too.

[Drago]

Holy flurking shnit.

Today's update was a doozy, and then some. Maybe it's as a Pokemon fan, maybe it's because it's a new character, and maybe it's just genuine originality points, but...

"Red" is on the roster.

At first glance, I stood aghast. Red a Smasher? How?? He doesn't hit people! He doesn't do any of his own bidding! The only thing he was good for was rubbing a Captain's back... And, in true Nintendo fashion, we're given all those exact qualities (well, not so much the back rubbing), because in effect, we were given three playable Pokemon characters; Squirtle, Ivysaur and Charizard. Wow... just absolutely wow.

For those too lazy to read, Ash/Red/Pokemon Trainer doesn't do squat diddly; he stands back and lets one of the three Pogeys do his battling, and you can freely shift between the three as the battle progresses. They all share the same damage meter, but have individual 'stamina' that wears thin if you don't cycle between the three evenly.

This delivers in so many fields, and in such an ingenious way. I really, really, really love this idea (definitely my favourite bit of news since Snake), and I also cheer Sakurai and his team for delivering on behalf of the legions of Charizard fans without making us Bulba and Squirtle family fans disappointed...

Just absolutely wow. Fan-fricking-tastic.

EDIT: I feel like I just can't state enough how excited I am about this character. I never thought my boy Bulb/Ivy/Venus would ever see the light of day on a Smash roster, but whaddya know, here it is; Ivyyyyyyyy!!

[ssj4supernerd]

Damn, Ike got in! Really, imho he should be replaced with Ephraim and the second FE char should be Hector, so we get some original weapons(And because Ike sucks but that's a personal opinion)


EDIT: Red indeed owns, and I read somewhere he can change(or outside of battle)clothes, so we prolly get Ruby and Diamond aswell(And maaaybe Gold)