Michelle Bachman: I want honest opinions

[Dark Sage]

Sorry, Blade. Cannoli.

Like I said, I wasn't born there, and I didn't have a dictionary handy.

[Gavin Luper]

Ohhhhhh cannoli! Seriously I love them so much. I hate being on this goddamn health kick haha.

I can't believe everyone on TPM is Italian and it never came up before. This is madness.

(I also wasn't born in Italy, but, like you guys, have the ancestry and the culture that never says die.)

[Magmar]

So glad TPM is chock full of Italians! For my birthday, I had frittata

[Roy Karrde]

I'm part German, that means I am united with you Italians under the "Pack of Steel agreement of 1939!"

[Mew Master]

I'm part German, that means I am united with you Italians under the "Pack of Steel agreement of 1939!"

Otherwise known as the "Axis Allies"[/badjoke]

[Jeff]

On most forums, casual conversations can turn into heated political debates. Leave it to TPM to do the opposite.

[mattbcl]

Agree with Jeff. Is someone passing around the proverbial bowl?

[Gavin Luper]

I'm part German, that means I am united with you Italians under the "Pack of Steel agreement of 1939!"

Eeep. Too soon, Roy. Too soon ...

[Dark Sage]

Hey, Roy! You say that Mr. Obama is trailing the "generic GOP candidate" in polls?

Well, according to FOX (a known conservative outlet), here's how he's doing in some polls where he was compared to some real GOP candidates:

Obama 47, Romney 41
Obama 49, Bachmann 38
Obama 47, Pawlenty 37
Obama 47, Perry 37

Remember, this is from Fox, a network whose target audience is conservatives. You yourself said that polls don't lie.

Edit: You're part German? Heck, I like bratwurst now and then... And lest we forget, hamburgers were invented in Germany...

[Gavin Luper]

Can anyone tell me what a GOP is? I'm not American.

I gather the Republicans but what does it stand for?

[Mew Master]

Grand Old Party.

Or as I like to call em: Giant Offending Pile

[Dark Sage]

I've been calling them Giant Offal Pile nowadays. They stink as bad as the elephant that they chose as their symbol.

[Gavin Luper]

Thanks Denny. Loving the alternative meanings you guys are coming up with though haha.

[Roy Karrde]

Hey, Roy! You say that Mr. Obama is trailing the "generic GOP candidate" in polls?

Well, according to FOX (a known conservative outlet), here's how he's doing in some polls where he was compared to some real GOP candidates:

Obama 47, Romney 41
Obama 49, Bachmann 38
Obama 47, Pawlenty 37
Obama 47, Perry 37

Remember, this is from Fox, a network whose target audience is conservatives. You yourself said that polls don't lie.

Edit: You're part German? Heck, I like bratwurst now and then... And lest we forget, hamburgers were invented in Germany...

And yet a Democrat friendly poll puts Obama at a tie with Romney, and seeing how it is heavily weighted toward Democrats he would actually be losing to Romney.

A Democratic polling firm said President Obama's already weak job-approval numbers are "worse than they appear" and he likely would lose the election if it were held today.

For the first time in a year, Mr. Obama does not lead former Massachusetts Gov. Mitt Romney in Public Policy Polling's monthly national poll on the 2012 presidential race. They are tied at 45 percent, and Mr. Obama is losing among independent voters by a margin of 49 percent to 44 percent.

Worse for Mr. Obama, PPP said, the "vast majority" of undecideds disapprove of the president's performance. The survey of registered voters was conducted July 15-17.

"There's a very good chance Barack Obama would lose if he had to stand for re-election today," said Dean Debnam, president of PPP. "This is his worst poll standing in a long time, and he really needs the economy to start turning around."

In an interview this week with a Kansas City, Mo., TV station, Mr. Obama said the election will be more about his record than the platform of the eventual Republican nominee.

"Americans understand that we didn't get into this problem overnight," Mr. Obama told KMBC-TV, one of three interviews he gave to regional TV outlets at the White House on Wednesday. "If next November they feel like I've ... been working as hard as I can and have been getting some things done to move us in the right direction, then I'll win. If they don't, then I'll lose."

http://www.washingtontimes.com/blog/...se-vote-today/

[Mew Master]

Thanks Denny. Loving the alternative meanings you guys are coming up with though haha.

Should see the bumper-sticker:

[b]Going senile? Join the GOP! They're all crazy anyway!

Rich? White? Don't care about the poor? Join the GOP!

[Classtoise]

Is it possible that both sides are using this to rally their base?

I.e Dems saying "Look Romney is a threat!" and Pubs saying "Look, Obamas a threat!" to get their base roused?

Or, y'know, the usual "Polls don't lie unless I disagree with them then they're full of crap"

EDIT: That and I wouldn't exactly call the Washington Times "democrat".

[mr_pikachu]

Is it possible that both sides are using this to rally their base?

I'd agree with you if we were a little closer to the election, but we're over a year out. Any such effect will have long since evaporated by November 2012. Perhaps if the election was only six months away, not sixteen, that would be a viable plan.

It's possible that one of the Republican camps could be doing this to gain an advantage in the primaries, I suppose, but Obama's campaign staff has no reason to do the same.

[Gavin Luper]

Hehehehe good one Denny.

Um, looking at DS' numbers, even if they are slightly biased coming from Fox or, let's just say they're not ... how the hell does Bachmann have that much support? That scares the crap out of me.

[Mew Master]

Um, looking at DS' numbers, even if they are slightly biased coming from Fox or, let's just say they're not ... how the hell does Bachmann have that much support? That scares the crap out of me.

How the hell did Sarah Palin become one 62 Year old's heartbeat away from sitting in teh White House even though she has the IQ equivalent of a Garden Slug (Apologies to actual Garden slugs as I know you're actually more intelligent than Palin).

[Gavin Luper]

How the hell did Sarah Palin become one 62 Year old's heartbeat away from sitting in teh White House even though she has the IQ equivalent of a Garden Slug (Apologies to actual Garden slugs as I know you're actually more intelligent than Palin).

Fair call. This whole situation is frightening. I repeat my stance that the ideal outcome for your country/freedom in general would be for Palin and Bachmann to annihilate each other.

[Mew Master]

Fair call. This whole situation is frightening. I repeat my stance that the ideal outcome for your country/freedom in general would be for Palin and Bachmann to annihilate each other.

So hope that they're like matter and anti-matter, pasta and anti-pasta, Sonic and Knuckles, Abbit and Costello...

Wait I got off track.. o.o

I think I'll just move to Japan.

[Gavin Luper]

So hope that they're like matter and anti-matter, pasta and anti-pasta, Sonic and Knuckles, Abbit and Costello...

Wait I got off track.. o.o

I think I'll just move to Japan.

XD

And grow some extra arms?

Okay, maybe too soon, but ... point is, it's not the ideal place to move to at the moment, is it?

I worry for America. And the EU. Everyone seems to be falling to bits right now.

[Mew Master]

End of the world in a year and a half.

[classy_cat18]

Maybe if some of us and some of Japan switched places, it would help America. Stupid comment but I'm grasping at straws here.

[Gavin Luper]

XD Shonta.

Sigh ... I can't wait until 2013 hits and everyone goes "oh, I was kidding about that whole end of the world thing".

[Dark Sage]

I'm just being realistic. Roy thinks that the Republicans still are the favored party, even though we're now on the verge of a second recession because they keep saying "no". Boehmer stormed out of his meeting with Obama last night, refusing to bargain, and it seems that a default is almost a certainty now.

When the Market crashes and people don't get their SS checks, all these polls that Roy keeps quoting aren't going to mean jack. People are going to want to lynch the GOP members of the House, not elect them.

[Mew Master]

Well an extra arm would come in handy after all.

And a serious question: What happens/What does it mean if America defaults on our debt?

[Asilynne]

Not all Republicans are crazy just like not all Democrats are assholes, just the loudest ones

The extremists on both sides tend to be the loudest ones anyway...That's why I hate US politics and its politicians, none of them have the peoples best interest at heart, they just play us by turning us against the other and doing a whole lot of talking but really have their own agendas which will benefit them. So no one in this country (or thread) should get on their high horse and say "my party's better" because ultimately they are the same corrupted mess as the other one.

As for Michelle-whatever, I don't know much about her because I've been too busy taking care of my immediate concerns. But if Donald Trump runs, even though most of the time I lean right, you can fuck that bastard lol. I guess if that happens I'd rather not vote, and I usually scorn the people who say that. But basically if you don't like either one what can you do?

[Magmar]

I guess if that happens I'd rather not vote, and I usually scorn the people who say that. But basically if you don't like either one what can you do?

When in doubt, vote for the turd sandwich.

[Roy Karrde]

I'm just being realistic. Roy thinks that the Republicans still are the favored party, even though we're now on the verge of a second recession because they keep saying "no". Boehmer stormed out of his meeting with Obama last night, refusing to bargain, and it seems that a default is almost a certainty now.

When the Market crashes and people don't get their SS checks, all these polls that Roy keeps quoting aren't going to mean jack. People are going to want to lynch the GOP members of the House, not elect them.

The GOP members of the house have passed two bills so far to deal with the deficit and the debt ceiling. The Ryan Plan, and Cut Cap and Balance. Cut Cap and Balance is favored by the vast, and I do mean vast majority of Americans according to CNN. That plan was stopped by Democrats in the Senate. The Senate which hasn't even suggested their own plan to the house. So... which party is saying "no" again?

How the hell did Sarah Palin become one 62 Year old's heartbeat away from sitting in teh White House even though she has the IQ equivalent of a Garden Slug (Apologies to actual Garden slugs as I know you're actually more intelligent than Palin).

You do realize how a person acts on the campaign trail, especially as a vice president =/= how they will act in office. Sarah Palin in Alaska had a career as a reformer, of going against the party, of being a moderate and working with Democrats to weed out corruption in Government. In many ways she had the same independent attributes John McCain has while in office.

[Dark Sage]

Are you out of your mind? They knew that the "Cut, Cap, and Balance" crapola had as much chance of becoming law as their repeal of the President's Health Care law. They wasted time doing it as a symbolic measure.

[Roy Karrde]

Are you out of your mind? They knew that the "Cut, Cap, and Balance" crapola had as much chance of becoming law as their repeal of the President's Health Care law. They wasted time doing it as a symbolic measure.

The only reason it doesn't have a chance is because of Democratic opposition. The public clearly wants it, as do Republicans.

[Classtoise]

Not all Republicans are crazy just like not all Democrats are assholes, just the loudest ones

The extremists on both sides tend to be the loudest ones anyway...That's why I hate US politics and its politicians, none of them have the peoples best interest at heart, they just play us by turning us against the other and doing a whole lot of talking but really have their own agendas which will benefit them. So no one in this country (or thread) should get on their high horse and say "my party's better" because ultimately they are the same corrupted mess as the other one.

As for Michelle-whatever, I don't know much about her because I've been too busy taking care of my immediate concerns. But if Donald Trump runs, even though most of the time I lean right, you can fuck that bastard lol. I guess if that happens I'd rather not vote, and I usually scorn the people who say that. But basically if you don't like either one what can you do?

Well, look at it this way.

Your choices might be Crazy Idiot (or just plain idiot if it's Palin) or Guy who hasn't done anything (including ending the world).

Even if you really don't like Obama, he's already proven he can go four years without ending our existence. I wouldn't give Bachmann that much trust


(And Trumps out anyway, last I heard)

[Mew Master]

Honestly Roy, I've seen polls and surveys where the public Doesn't want it. We can both find polls to show that we're both right, but it often comes down to comparing sizes in the locker room. :/

[DarkestLight]

Palin/Bachman 2012. :/

::Waits for it::

[Roy Karrde]

Honestly Roy, I've seen polls and surveys where the public Doesn't want it. We can both find polls to show that we're both right, but it often comes down to comparing sizes in the locker room. :/

Really? Feel free to post the poll, here is the CNN one.

"The CCB/BBA approach wins majorities in every single demographic — including self-described liberals. Sixty-three percent of Democrats back the House bill. The least supportive age demographic is 50-64YOs at 62/37; the least supportive regional demographic is the Midwest at 61/39. Even those who express opposition to the Tea Party supports it 53/47.

In other words, it’s a clean sweep. Simply put, there is no political demographic at all where the CCB/BBA doesn’t get majority support. The BBA on its own does even better. It gets 3-1 support (74/24), and except for those Tea Party opponents (56%) and self-professed liberals (61/37), doesn’t get below 70% support in any demographic."

http://hotair.com/archives/2011/07/2...s-in-cnn-poll/

[Dark Sage]

Roy, I've spoken to everyone I connect with on Facebook, everyone my dad connects to on Facebook, everyone on every news group I belong to... And I think you're delusional.

The wealthiest 5% of Americans want the Cut, Cap, and Balance plan. That's about it. Might I add, this is the group that owns CNN, a network whose yellow journalism convicted Casey Anthony of murder before she even had her day in court. That 5%, by the way, are the only true Republicans. Everyone else who calls themselves a Republican is just someone who is being lied to by the true GOP.

Edit: I tried to post a reply to the article that your link led to. The poll. I stated my honest opinion of the GOP's plan. My reply was never posted.

[Roy Karrde]

Roy, I've spoken to everyone I connect with on Facebook, everyone my dad connects to on Facebook, everyone on every news group I belong to... And I think you're delusional.

The wealthiest 5% of Americans want the Cut, Cap, and Balance plan. That's about it. Might I add, this is the group that owns CNN, a network whose yellow journalism convicted Casey Anthony of murder before she even had her day in court. That 5%, by the way, are the only true Republicans. Everyone else who calls themselves a Republican is just someone who is being lied to by the true GOP.

So let me get this straight you have no proof that CNN, one of the largest news organizations in the United States has faked the poll, but because you have talked to a microscopic group of people, you believe that it is true. That is so unbelievable even I wouldn't use it as a excuse and I have made some pretty pathetic excuses in the past when it comes to debating as Heald and Blademaster can attest to.

Anyway on the subject, it appears that President Obama has killed not one but TWO Bipartisan deals. The first one was Friday night in which the Republicans and Democrats agreed to 800 billion in revenue increases, realizing that such a deal may end this crisis, Obama then pushed for 400 billion more, knowing the Republicans couldn't make that.

The second one came last night, when The Speaker, Senator Reid and Senator McConnell all agreed on a two part framework. The problem for Obama? This puts the debt issue up again during the election season. And being the feckless piece of trash he is, he would rather have a easier time campaigning than fixing this crisis. So he called Harry Reid in, and just a few hours later Reid pulled out of the framework.

Nice to know we have a President that cares more about his own re election than saving this country from default.

[Dark Sage]

Obama did not kill the bills. They were voted down by the Senate, in the democratic system that this country was founded on.

At least they got to vote on it. Now, if it was a Democrat-supported bill, the GOP would have fillibustered it to prevent it from coming to the floor at all.

I didn't say the CNN poll was faked. I'm saying it was skewed.

And furthermore, the President has agreed to meet the GOP halfway. Why hasn't the GOP? Tell me that.

[Roy Karrde]

Obama did not kill the bills. They were voted down by the Senate, in the democratic system that this country was founded on.

At least they got to vote on it. Now, if it was a Democrat-supported bill, the GOP would have fillibustered it to prevent it from coming to the floor at all.

You may have missed what I was saying. Last Friday and Yesterday, the Democrats and Republicans both in the Senate and House agreed to bills, but Obama killed both bills by either pressuring for even higher tax increases than what the Democrats and Republicans had agreed to, or by calling up Harry Reid Sunday night and pressuring him to back out. This is not Cut Cap and Balance, these are two bills that the sides were working on this weekend, and both killed by the Obama Administration.

I didn't say the CNN poll was faked. I'm saying it was skewed.

And your proof is....?

And furthermore, the President has agreed to meet the GOP halfway. Why hasn't the GOP? Tell me that.

They did, Friday night in agreeing to 800 billion in revenue increases. And then Obama said "Well if you guys are going to do 800 billion, then I want 1.2 trillion instead." Thing you need to learn about the President is that: The President lies.